Mistr Posted September 15, 2017 Report Share Posted September 15, 2017 Mistr Makes Time Challenge 32 I've been thinking about the things I'm struggling with. They all come down to me being unhappy about how what I want to do matches up with what I actually do. I used to think this was a time management problem. Now I think that is the wrong approach. I'm not spending much time goofing off. This is not about being more efficient. It is about thinking about time and choices from a whole different angle. Part I - Why do I want to do this? I enjoy it It will help me reach my goals It will make my life better It will make my family's life better Someone is pressuring me to do it I am making a bet that this will pay off down the line Part II - Is now the right time for this? yes - this is urgent and needs to get done yes - this is something that fits well in the time between other things yes - this task has risen to the top of my list no - I need to check with other people first no - someone else has taken responsibility for this no - this is not important enough to spend time doing now, if ever Hopefully answering these two questions will help me choose the things to do that will make me a happier camper and make my life better. I want to reduce my stress level by taking off some of the pressure to do ALL THE THINGS. Ever since I was a kid I wanted to do more things than I have time to do. At this point in my life, most of the pressure is coming from me - not other people. No one gets on my case at home if I let my cleaning tasks slide. Certainly no one complains if I don't do creative projects. My family is likely to push me to do aikido because I am a nicer person when I practice. They don't ask for much. I feel responsible all on my own. I'm not sure yet how I will track this. I'm still going to make lists so that it is easier for me to remember stuff on my wish list and see progress. I like the way @chemgeek and @Xena have been tracking tasks. TBD 5 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
chemgeek Posted September 16, 2017 Report Share Posted September 16, 2017 Thanks for the compliment on my tracking system. It's something I started doing at work to help with my time management, and it worked so well I ported it here. I find reviewing my daily goals in the morning, setting them, keeps them at the front of my mind - and then coming back to check them off/cross them out when I'm done creates self-accountability, in a way having a list on a wall does not. Quote Link to comment
RisenPhoenix Posted September 18, 2017 Report Share Posted September 18, 2017 On 9/15/2017 at 5:52 PM, Mistr said: I used to think this was a time management problem. Now I think that is the wrong approach. I'm not spending much time goofing off. This is not about being more efficient. It is about thinking about time and choices from a whole different angle. This is legitimately how I'm viewing my first week and what I was thinking about. I've been so 'efficient' with my time that I've hyperstacked my life and realized I am spending too much time running around. I enjoy doing all the things, but I also don't *need* to do all the things to feel accomplished. I think. Working on that part. 3 Quote RisenPhoenix, the Entish Aikidoka Challenge: RisenPhoenix Turns to Ash "The essence of koryu [...is] you offer your loyalty to something that you choose to regard as greater than yourself so that you will, someday, be able to offer service to something that truly is transcendent." ~ Ellis Amdur, Old School Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 I had a good conversation last night with Dumbledore about time and choices. It started with me venting frustration about my day. I spent all of Tuesday trying to get caught up with requests at work. Mostly emails. It felt like swimming upstream. I'd get a couple things done, then more would come in. I didn't even touch anything on my project list. I went to a poster session/reception from 4-5, then stayed another hour and a half to finish things up. By the end I was done with all the new stuff and quite a bit of the older ones. By that point I was out of energy. I stopped by the pet food store on my way home to get more cat litter and some cat toys. I haven't seen the first set of cat toys in a couple weeks. I suspect they are all under the dryer. I got a couple of the corrugated cardboard scratching mats. Amber had her claws clipped at the vet last week, but she clearly wants to claw the furniture. I was pleased to see the cats start playing with the new toys right away. They are having a grand time zooming through the house. Dorian approved of the ball-in-a-box toy. Next time I'm going to get toys that light up but don't make noise. He played with it all night. My original plan had me making one stop on the way home then spending an hour or so cooking vegetables. In theory I had time to do that last night. In practice, I just wanted to sit and read by the time I got home. I tried the "just one chapter" ploy and failed completely. It was 10:30pm when I finished the book. Just then Dumbledore got home. He demonstrated great active listening skills as I incoherently talked about how I felt. TL;DR Take Home Message: Do the fun thing first He told me about how his whole attitude towards tasks has changed since he rented office space and started taking dedicated time to work on his creative projects. He has made more progress on his business plan in the last two weeks than in the last year. The amazing part is that he is much more willing to do his household chores and tedious work tasks (grading). Same with exercising. All the things that typically start with "I should" have gotten better. On my side, I can see that I need to deal with the ghosts of my Minnesotan upbringing. I hear the ghosts of my grandmother's voices telling me how to manage a household. My household has three adults working 30-50 hours a week (plus one working 40 hours a week and going to school full time - he is out of the reckoning). Our division of labor is completely different than the traditional model they knew. No one at home is going to get on my case for taking longer to do the things I said I would do. In fact, both Dumbledore and Elf have told me I should take more time to relax. I want to do some experimenting with this life-is-uncertain, eat-dessert-first approach to time at home. I tried it at work today and got several projects done. At work it means ignoring email entirely for chunks of time. Get something done. Deal with a couple emails, then work on a fun project. Hopefully the promising preliminary results will be confirmed tomorrow and Friday. 2 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 Things I like doing: Aikido Fiber arts Reading Time with family Playing with cats Time with friends I also want to do more zazen. More details on this in the Meditation Chamber here. I'm not sure zazen falls under things I like. It is certainly something I care about that I have wanted to do for a long time. "Like" is not quite the right word. 3 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
sarakingdom Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 15 hours ago, Mistr said: TL;DR Take Home Message: Do the fun thing first He told me about how his whole attitude towards tasks has changed since he rented office space and started taking dedicated time to work on his creative projects. He has made more progress on his business plan in the last two weeks than in the last year. The amazing part is that he is much more willing to do his household chores and tedious work tasks (grading). Same with exercising. All the things that typically start with "I should" have gotten better. I think I need to hear more about this concept and how it works in practice. Quote I felt like I could run forever, like I could smell the wind and feel the grass under my feet, and just run forever. Current Challenge: #24 - Mrs. Cosmopolite Challenge Past: #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11a & #11b, #12, #13, #14, #15, #16, #17, #18, #19, #20, #21, #22, #23 Link to comment
Kishi Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 I hope it works out. I'm trying that approach out with my training now, and while it's not exactly a relaxed life, it's definitely nice to finish each training session feeling relatively refreshed. I hope it works out for you! Quote Work like a farmer, train like an athlete, fight like a soldier. 2 Tim. 2:3-6 BATTLE! Link to comment
chemgeek Posted September 22, 2017 Report Share Posted September 22, 2017 I get you on that front- I was the eldest kid in a big family and old fashioned family and basically any time I was openly idle at all I would get more work piled on because I was supposed to set a good example by being a child workaholic I guess... Anyway, I have a really hard time making time to relax and not working when others are working. I hear my parents calling me lazy and undisciplined and entitled if I am not helping with chores even if I just finished a 12h work day. It is also why I have a hard time saying no to tasks... I need to learn that it is ok to not do everything, cuz my current cycle of overwork till burnout, neglect housework for months while recuperating, repeat does not work. Tl;dr: I second Sara Kingdom about needing to hear more about this. Quote Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 25, 2017 On 9/21/2017 at 7:49 AM, sarakingdom said: I think I need to hear more about this concept and how it works in practice. So far I think it is helping. I've done it for two weekends and the intervening week. I am definitely getting more done at work. Details later. Work is still way too busy. We are two people short plus two people out of the office this week. Not looking promising. 2 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 26, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2017 Status report I feel like overall I've been productive and did more relaxing things than usual. Caught up on things at work on Wednesday (temporary but still gratifying). Practiced entering with a shinai at lunch. Boy, does that need more work. Taught aikido in the evening. Small class so I got to train too. Went well. I got home from dropping off one of my students and felt weird. Dizzy. Got sick. I'm still not sure what it was. Possibly food poisoning, but my stomach was not nearly as upset as would be typical. I stayed home Thursday and slept it off. Thursday I had a whole afternoon at home with no agenda. I did a bunch of normal stuff: put away clean dishes fed the cats gentle exercise meditation laundry walked to the grocery store to get out of the house and get a couple things wound off a bobbin of yarn into a skein made granola made cock-a-leeky soup played computer games Dumbledore asked me to take over his task of taking Dorian to the vet. I would have, but I couldn't find him. Not that he was hiding because he knew something was up. Dorian has found somewhere in the house for his afternoon nap that is well camouflaged. There have been several evenings when we've been worried because no one could find him. He eventually comes out, stretches and gets back to being a little terror. I rescheduled for Saturday morning when chances were better that Dorian would be out and about. I noticed that even though I got quite a bit done, I did not feel especially accomplished. The biggest emotional win was the soup because it used up CSA veggies. I made a point of winding off the yarn so I could say I did something with fiber. Friday was very busy at work. I ended up staying late and still was not done. One of those days when things come in faster than I could take care of them and send them out. I took a break before aikido to play games on my phone. I was already late. I decided that I would handle being patient with my partners and myself much better if I did something relaxing first. I think that was a good call. I felt much better after 1.5 hours of aikido. Stayed up late to talk with Dumbledore and do meditation. Saturday I mostly caught up on sleep and did meditation. Then things went sideways. Dumbledore was helping me get Dorian into the cat carrier by throwing a ball. That would have worked if I had been quick enough. As it was, Dorian squirmed out of the carrier and I grabbed him. He struggled and bit me. I was not going to let him get away with that and got him into the carrier. Then I had to go wash the blood off my hands. Shortly followed by having to lie down with my feet elevated because I felt shocky. Probably the adrenaline wearing off right when the pain hit. Dumbledore decided to drive me and the cat to the vet because he was concerned about me. Probably a smart move. I was concerned that Dorian would continue to be a Tasmanian Devil at the vet. Nope. He was a shivering pile of fur. Poor kitty was terrified. I'm glad I went along both to see what happened and because the vet let me use their chlorohexidine wash for my hands. It stung like mad but the bites hurt less afterwards. Dumbledore was mad both about the drama with the cat and that he missed project time at his office. I still owe him on that one. Luckily Hermes stopped by home and was able to give me a ride to Urgent Care. I would have been fine to drive there. I was concerned because the one time I passed out in a doctor's office was under similar circumstances. I had been bitten by my first cat (my fault) and got penicillin and tetanus shots. This time went better. They did give me a tetanus booster, but only a prescription for antibiotics. And a prescription for pain meds. The doctor was correct in predicting that my wounds would hurt more in the evening when I tried to sleep. I left looking like a zombie with bandages on my hand and arm. Turns out there are additional consequences besides the wound care. By state law, Animal Control has to be informed about pet bites. The pet is put on quarantine and has to have three clean vet checks to prove it does not have rabies. So my frustrated response to my kitten is costing me about $250 in extra medical bills for him and me. Aside from the feline drama, the weekend went well. I did a bunch of cooking on Saturday night wearing disposable gloves over my bandages. It felt weird to wear gloves in a food prep situation. I'm used to wearing gloves in a lab were food is NOT ALLOWED. I made chocolate cheesecake, baked squash and sauteed greens with bacon. Spent some time hanging out with Elf and their friends. More later. I stayed up too late reading Midnight Riot last night. Plus we had three people out at work today. Gah. We'll see what I choose to get done at home tonight. Taking a nap might be the first order of business. Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Treva Posted September 27, 2017 Report Share Posted September 27, 2017 1 hour ago, Mistr said: Turns out there are additional consequences besides the wound care. By state law, Animal Control has to be informed about pet bites. The pet is put on quarantine and has to have three clean vet checks to prove it does not have rabies. So my frustrated response to my kitten is costing me about $250 in extra medical bills for him and me. That sounds way too eventful for a trip to the vet. My goodness. I'm sorry to hear about your hand and all the pain and additional suffering involved. 1 hour ago, Mistr said: Aside from the feline drama, the weekend went well. I did a bunch of cooking on Saturday night wearing disposable gloves over my bandages. It felt weird to wear gloves in a food prep situation. I'm used to wearing gloves in a lab were food is NOT ALLOWED. I am cringing just hearing about it! I am glad that you were able to cook anyways, despite having a zombie arm. I really admire your commitment to doing the fun things first. It sounds like that's been a healthy thing that let you do a lot of the things you like to do! Quote Current Challenge Battle Log Breathe deep. Seek peace. Bring a sword. ---Kishi Link to comment
sarakingdom Posted September 27, 2017 Report Share Posted September 27, 2017 Gah, silly cat. 1 hour ago, Mistr said: I stayed up too late reading Midnight Riot last night. That's the way to do it! 1 Quote I felt like I could run forever, like I could smell the wind and feel the grass under my feet, and just run forever. Current Challenge: #24 - Mrs. Cosmopolite Challenge Past: #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11a & #11b, #12, #13, #14, #15, #16, #17, #18, #19, #20, #21, #22, #23 Link to comment
Kishi Posted September 27, 2017 Report Share Posted September 27, 2017 Wah! Bad kitty! Sorry to hear that he freaked out and bit you. It sounds like you've already considered rabies and other possible problems, so now it's just down to waiting out the discomfort. 14 hours ago, Mistr said: I did a bunch of cooking on Saturday night wearing disposable gloves over my bandages. It felt weird to wear gloves in a food prep situation. I'm used to wearing gloves in a lab were food is NOT ALLOWED. That is completely the opposite of my experience, where disposable gloves were required for handling food. Quote Work like a farmer, train like an athlete, fight like a soldier. 2 Tim. 2:3-6 BATTLE! Link to comment
RisenPhoenix Posted September 27, 2017 Report Share Posted September 27, 2017 15 hours ago, Mistr said: It felt weird to wear gloves in a food prep situation. I'm used to wearing gloves in a lab were food is NOT ALLOWED. See, then you have me. Where I've historically stolen gloves from work to DO food prep stuff (I really hate touching raw chicken). 1 Quote RisenPhoenix, the Entish Aikidoka Challenge: RisenPhoenix Turns to Ash "The essence of koryu [...is] you offer your loyalty to something that you choose to regard as greater than yourself so that you will, someday, be able to offer service to something that truly is transcendent." ~ Ellis Amdur, Old School Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2017 6 hours ago, RisenPhoenix said: See, then you have me. Where I've historically stolen gloves from work to DO food prep stuff (I really hate touching raw chicken). Yes, I thought about that quite a bit. I don't mind touching raw meat that much, but it does lead to washing my hands repeatedly. I'm certainly not going to touch any food with open wounds on my hands. I miss the good nitrile gloves from the lab. I got a box of cheap nitrile gloves at Costco (earlier this year, thankfully). They are better than cheap latex gloves, but not nearly as nice as the ones we get for lab use. On the plus side, I feel no qualms about changing gloves when I use these. Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Teirin Posted September 28, 2017 Report Share Posted September 28, 2017 Yikes, glad you take cat bites seriously. Many people really don't here. Quote Behave yourself, badly if necessary. Current Challenge Judo - Shodan My Character Link to comment
juliebarkley Posted September 28, 2017 Report Share Posted September 28, 2017 I have a hack for getting cats into a carrier when they don't want to be there. It has to be a box-type carrier that opens in the front. Instead of trying to shove the cat in the front, stand the box on its end, with the opening facing up. Lower the cat into the carrier backwards, close the door, and carefully turn it right way up. It is very hard for the cat to resist. I could get my bitey, scratchy cat (RIP) into the carrier in seconds this way. 1 Quote Challenge: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2017 16 hours ago, juliebarkley said: I have a hack for getting cats into a carrier when they don't want to be there. It has to be a box-type carrier that opens in the front. Instead of trying to shove the cat in the front, stand the box on its end, with the opening facing up. Lower the cat into the carrier backwards, close the door, and carefully turn it right way up. It is very hard for the cat to resist. I could get my bitey, scratchy cat (RIP) into the carrier in seconds this way. That would be a great idea if I could pick up the cat. He is not at all a fan of that idea. We are working on getting him to calm down around people. He actually came up to me for pats this morning. A vet who makes home visits is coming over tomorrow and again in a week for the third check-up. Expensive but worth it to not freak out the cat. 1 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Mistr Posted September 29, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2017 This weekend will be a test of the positive choice system. I'm going on a road trip. Even before the fact it looks overbooked. Originally I was going to do a solo trip. Stay with an old friend, go to an aikido friendship seminar, talk to my brother and generally relax. Last weekend I learned that another old friend decided to celebrate his birthday this weekend. So Dumbledore and Elf are coming with me. We decided against staying with my friend because she does not have much space and we will not have much time. I'm going to try to get together with her for breakfast on Sunday. After that we are meeting my brother for lunch. Thankfully Dumbledore and Elf will have all day Saturday to do what they want while I am at aikido. Last night Dumbledore was wound to the point of breaking about not having time for project work. He said he might just camp out in the hotel Saturday while Elf and I go off to do things. That assumes that Elf feels okay driving a manual in city traffic. Possible, but not fun. I used my best blending skills and talked Dumbledore down as we went for a walk and went out to dinner last night. I know he only got 6 hours of sleep between now and then. Maybe he can sleep in the car. I feel like I have to be at my best because things will go badly if we are both stressed at the same time. I'm working on using my zen and self-persuasive skills to convince myself that this will be a weekend full of fun things rather than a weekend that is programmed from one end to the other. Massive amounts of chocolate may be involved. Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Kishi Posted September 29, 2017 Report Share Posted September 29, 2017 Well, a full weekend is a full weekend. It'll be pretty awesome, sounds like, but it will be full. It takes a lot of skill to navigate that kind of thing. Good, positive decisions are completely possible here. You can make them. For real. I think this change of pace could be a lot of fun for you guys, and I hope it turns out that way. Quote Work like a farmer, train like an athlete, fight like a soldier. 2 Tim. 2:3-6 BATTLE! Link to comment
RisenPhoenix Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 On 9/29/2017 at 12:54 PM, Mistr said: go to an aikido friendship seminar, Please tell me this was the seminar with Okomoto Sensei in Montreal. Because I practiced at her dojo in Kyoto and she WAS AMAZING. Quote RisenPhoenix, the Entish Aikidoka Challenge: RisenPhoenix Turns to Ash "The essence of koryu [...is] you offer your loyalty to something that you choose to regard as greater than yourself so that you will, someday, be able to offer service to something that truly is transcendent." ~ Ellis Amdur, Old School Link to comment
Mistr Posted October 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 7 hours ago, RisenPhoenix said: Please tell me this was the seminar with Okomoto Sensei in Montreal. Because I practiced at her dojo in Kyoto and she WAS AMAZING. Sorry to disappoint you. It was a friendship seminar in Minneapolis. Seven Midwest senseis. Unlike most seminars, the format was in small groups rather than the senseis taking turns. There were about 10 people in each group. That meant we all got a lot of personal attention from the senseis, but did not get to train with as many different people. It also meant that the instructors got less training time and they had to teach longer. In theory they taught the same things to each small group. I suspect there were variations. Normally one of the highlights of friendship seminars is that you can train with senior instructors when they aren't teaching. Not so much of that with this format. I was surprised at how small the seminar was. There were four students (including me) and an instructor from my dojo. The Omaha dojo had a good group of people. I did not see anyone but the instructor from Aikido of Minnesota, which was disappointing. There was one person from Twin Cities Aikido. The host dojo had several people, but not a lot. There were a bunch of people I never got to talk with, so maybe they were from other dojos. The mat was full but not crowded. It was a fun day. 3 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Xena Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 On 9/26/2017 at 6:30 PM, Mistr said: Saturday I mostly caught up on sleep and did meditation. Then things went sideways. Dumbledore was helping me get Dorian into the cat carrier by throwing a ball. That would have worked if I had been quick enough. As it was, Dorian squirmed out of the carrier and I grabbed him. He struggled and bit me. I was not going to let him get away with that and got him into the carrier. Then I had to go wash the blood off my hands. Shortly followed by having to lie down with my feet elevated because I felt shocky. Probably the adrenaline wearing off right when the pain hit. Dumbledore decided to drive me and the cat to the vet because he was concerned about me. Probably a smart move. I was concerned that Dorian would continue to be a Tasmanian Devil at the vet. Nope. He was a shivering pile of fur. Poor kitty was terrified. I'm glad I went along both to see what happened and because the vet let me use their chlorohexidine wash for my hands. It stung like mad but the bites hurt less afterwards. Dumbledore was mad both about the drama with the cat and that he missed project time at his office. I still owe him on that one. I think you should pretty much get a free pass when you are bleeding and shock-y. ----------- But kitty drama aside, I thought of this right away with your time allocation ideas. (Apparently mistakenly attributed to Freud. I have no idea, I just think it's cute...and true) 1 Quote Xena, Level 14+ Valkyrie Ranger January 2017 December 2016 Oct/Nov 2016 Link to comment
Mistr Posted October 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 On 9/29/2017 at 11:54 AM, Mistr said: This weekend will be a test of the positive choice system. I'm going on a road trip. Even before the fact it looks overbooked. ... I'm working on using my zen and self-persuasive skills to convince myself that this will be a weekend full of fun things rather than a weekend that is programmed from one end to the other. Massive amounts of chocolate may be involved. Overall the weekend worked out much better than I expected. I was right about my time being fully programmed. As it turned out I had a couple hours on Sunday morning. That time had been earmarked for breakfast with a friend, but she did not get back to me. I can't say I was sorry about that under the circumstances. It also helped that Dumbledore's board decided to have their meeting over Skype rather than in person. I did a short meditation and went shopping at Ikea. We were staying a mile away from the Ikea store and the temptation was real. I picked up a few things we needed and a couple extra kitchen tools that were cool. I was right on time until I got into the check-out line. I always forget how long those are at Ikea. Even with the delay I got back to the hotel just as Dumbledore was finishing his meeting and Elf was packing up. My stuff was already packed and in the car. I was able to be calm and helpful instead of stressed. We were 15 minutes late for lunch with my brother, but no one was upset about it. We had a great time. I was reassured to learn that Mom is doing okay. She has health problems and understands how they affect her. She's not happy about those, but is coping reasonably well. My brother is willing to be the point person on dealing with the family lake place. That pushes off my worries on that front for a few years. I did most of the freeway driving both ways. Elf kept me company and played music while Dumbledore napped and read in the back. That worked out well for everyone. I don't get upset at bad drivers like Dumbledore does. I still say things when someone does something stupid. Like when I was in the fast lane to pass a slow vehicle and the car in front of me suddenly slowed down and turned left onto a service road that crossed the median. WTF!!!!! If Dumbledore hadn't yelled a warning we would have hit them. Nothing that shocking happened on the return trip but traffic was heavy and slow. I was tired of being responsible by the time we got home. Massive amounts of chocolate were indeed involved in me keeping my cool. 2 Quote Level 68 Viking paladin My current challenge Battle log Link to comment
Kishi Posted October 5, 2017 Report Share Posted October 5, 2017 Ah, that is good news. A good weekend capped off by not dying on the road. But more to the point, it's good to see that things worked out, stress was managed, things were done, and you were ultimately able to travel and do the things you wanted to do. I'm glad to hear that the men/folk did their part to make sure that things stayed cool and even. And also glad that your mom is managing her health. Hopefully those worries will be far off for some time yet. Quote Work like a farmer, train like an athlete, fight like a soldier. 2 Tim. 2:3-6 BATTLE! Link to comment
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