Arkania's life will be cleared to the base with downshifting

[Ensi]

14 hours ago, Tobbe said:

 

Thanks for this way of looking at it! Makes it much less scary. Of course I want to be able to eat intuitively for the rest of my life. But if I jump in to it too early, I can always back out, and then try again later, when I'm ready (both mind and body). That's a very relieving insight.  

 

You can give yourself a time limit, and another thing is to recognize the diet mentality, and start working on your fear foods one at a time. If you're scared of eating pizza, hamburgers and ice cream, start with just allowing pizza. Recognize the thoughts, and work on them one at a time. This way, you won't get overwhelmed

 

14 hours ago, Tobbe said:

Just a couple? I'd like to be able to not think about food for five hours at least. 

 

This is something that I'm a little bit worried about. I'm not ready to give up food as a hobby/an interest. But obviously I don't want to be as obsessed with it as I am now. At least not in the way I am now.

 

I listened to a podcast this morning about Intuitive Eating and weight gain. One of the hosts, who has been doing IE for pretty long now, said that she had to buy new clothes about every six months because she kept gaining weight. And she was above 25 in BMI when she started with IE... Me, being skinny, not fat, will probably gain even more, even faster. And that scares the shit out of me. But I'm not 100% sure why. I mean, what would it matter if I was fat? Would anyone care? Would I feel so bad? I don't know... But I also don't want to "try" just to find out, because once you've gained weight it's much harder to get rid of it again!

 

We're all individuals, and I'm sure it's possible to go five hours without thinking food, if you just eat enough. Personally, I'm good with eating a bigger meal every 3 to 4 hours, and an afternoon snack and an evening snack. It can vary from day to day, though! I also notice that the more I eat early in the day, the less hungry I am in the evening.

 

Food can be a hobby and an interest, for sure, but what you're giving up is the unhealthy relationship to food - food's not meant to scare you! It's meant to make you feel energetic and healthy. Personally, I enjoy food more when I'm eating without rules and fears. I don't really know you, but it sounds to me that you are pretty tense around food and eating without rules. And that's totally understandable! You can take this as slow as you want, working one thought and food at a time  When I started eating carbs, it was terrible! I was really scared about eating bread, but I was so done with being scared of and obsessed with food that I saw no other option than to try and see it for myself, instead of believing all the diet rules there are. Now I know that there's no specific food that makes me gain weight. Being stressed and unbalanced does. And I can't tell you what happens to your weight. I didn't gain weight like crazy, and I still fit in my clothes. My body composition changed, though, and I was really happy with that change (hellooo I have hips now ). But I also think that it's totally OK to have some guidelines about what to eat, and what not. I have my own set of guidelines, and I know which foods make me feel good and what don't. It's not like "whatever", but instead it's me who makes the rules, and not some outer force that tells me how to live.

 

14 hours ago, Tobbe said:

 

Yeah, the mindset is a much bigger problem for me. And one that feels much harder to fix/heal  

 

Does any of these help you?

 

 

I think the most important thing is to understand that life's messy, and your body doesn't need the perfect conditions at all times to function properly. Take it slow, and get to know yourself

[Tobbe]

23 hours ago, Ensi said:

start working on your fear foods one at a time. If you're scared of eating pizza, hamburgers and ice cream, start with just allowing pizza. Recognize the thoughts, and work on them one at a time.

 

This sounds like step 3 of IE, "Make Peace with Food". I got really skeptical when I read that part of the book. To me it sounded like they oversimplified it too much. They use Oreo cookies as an example in the book. They say to keep your cupboards stocked with Oreo cookies so that you will never have to fear running out of cookies, and then let yourself eat as many as you want, when you want. And after a while you're supposed to realize that - "Meh, ain't so much special about Oreo cookies anymore". And sure, that might work. The problem is that if I did that with regular Oreo cookies, I'd still have the Golden Oreos, the Oreo thins, the coconut Oreos, the Double Chocolate Oreos, etc to go through. Or let's say it's ice cream. First I begin with vanilla ice cream. But then there's Strawberry ice cream, blueberry ice cream, cookie dough ice cream, ice cream with fresh banana, ice cream with strawberry jam, ice cream with meringue, ice cream with caramel sauce, ice cream with salted caramel sauce, etc... The lists can go on and on and on... I'd never be done with step 3 if I were to eliminate all the foods I can't stop eating one by one.

 

On 10/25/2018 at 12:41 PM, Ensi said:

but it sounds to me that you are pretty tense around food and eating without rules

 

Totally! Yesterday evening I ate a meal that when I planned it thought was a healthy meal (basically a big salad). But after eating I still freaked out and felt like sh*t because I had forgotten to weigh the different parts of the meal when putting them on my plate  

 

On 10/25/2018 at 12:41 PM, Ensi said:

Being stressed and unbalanced does

 

I know this in the logical part of my brain. All this stress about food/weight/exercise is probably worse for my health than any cake I might have eaten during the years I've been ill  But unfortunately my logical part of my brain doesn't get it's say and will through too often these days  

 

On 10/25/2018 at 12:41 PM, Ensi said:

And I can't tell you what happens to your weight. I didn't gain weight like crazy, and I still fit in my clothes.

 

I know you can't. Nobody can. Not even me. If someone could just promise me "You won't gain more than 20 pounds, no matter what" I'd jump straight in to it without a second thought! Thanks for sharing your experience though, makes me a little bit less scared of trying.

 

On 10/25/2018 at 12:41 PM, Ensi said:

Does any of these help you?

 

On days (or hours of a day) that I'm feeling better I'm pretty good at knowing when it's my ED speaking (or the "Diet Mind" if you will). And often, even when I'm behaving like crap, like punishing myself by not eating, I know that it's totally just the "Diet Mindset" that's running the show. But I still continue doing it. I know the thoughts and feelings I have aren't normal, and belongs to the ED, but that doesn't help. I still listen to those voices. I still can't just act like a normal person.

[Mad Hatter]

I don’t want to keep hijacking @Arkania‘s thread but I just wanted to ask about this:

 

1 hour ago, Tobbe said:

If someone could just promise me "You won't gain more than 20 pounds, no matter what" I'd jump straight in to it without a second thought! 

Would you though? As a thought experiment -how would you feel about eating intuitively until you gained 20 pounds, however long that would take, as opposed to trying it out for a set period like a month?

[Tobbe]

9 minutes ago, Mad Hatter said:

Would you though? As a thought experiment -how would you feel about eating intuitively until you gained 20 pounds, however long that would take, as opposed to trying it out for a set period like a month?

 

I'd be super scared! What if the weight (fat) gain didn't stop after those 20 pounds? What if I during this period of eating have just gotten in to a whole lot of bad eating habits that I now can't get rid of? Now that I've created all these new fat cells, I'll never be able to get rid of them for the rest of my life (fact). I can empty them, but they will just continue to scream for being filled again! So I gained 20 pounds, with nothing good coming out of it, only bad things!

[Tobbe]

Just now, Tobbe said:

as opposed to trying it out for a set period like a month?

 

A month is too long too  I know what happens when I eat whatever for just a little over a week, like on vacation. I gain 10 pounds! Extrapolating that to a month is 40 pounds! Sure, at first I might just be adding water to my body. So the weight gain will probably not be linear. But still. I put on a lot of weight really fast if I just eat whatever/whenever. This also adds to my fear. If I knew I'd just naturally lean towards going for the healthier food I wouldn't be so worried. But I don't. If I put a gag on my ED voice I'll always go for the tasty food. Not the healthy.

[Ensi]

43 minutes ago, Mad Hatter said:

I don’t want to keep hijacking @Arkania‘s thread but

 

Same, BUT  Tobbe, it's wonderful that you write all these ideas out here so that they don't just exist in your own mind. I'm really glad for it. Because this:

 

2 hours ago, Tobbe said:

The problem is that if I did that with regular Oreo cookies, I'd still have the Golden Oreos, the Oreo thins, the coconut Oreos, the Double Chocolate Oreos, etc to go through. Or let's say it's ice cream. First I begin with vanilla ice cream. But then there's Strawberry ice cream, blueberry ice cream, cookie dough ice cream, ice cream with fresh banana, ice cream with strawberry jam, ice cream with meringue, ice cream with caramel sauce, ice cream with salted caramel sauce, etc... The lists can go on and on and on... I'd never be done with step 3 if I were to eliminate all the foods I can't stop eating one by one.

 

This is first class eating disorder bologna. Your eating disorder is trying to make things too complicated, because it doesn't want you to even try  (btw, handling your cravings with regular Oreos works with any kind of Oreos). After reading your latest posts, though, I'd recommend you to really focus on why gaining weight scares you so much. That's the root reason the eating disorder exists in the first place. Mine existed, because I felt like I was completely worthless as a human being, and my way of measuring my value was how well I followed my food rules and how little I weighed. I thought that weight gain == social abandonment, loneliness, and being seen as lazy and bad. Do we live in a society that tells us this about overweight people? Yeah. Does it mean it's right? Nope. It's not your fault that you have thoughts like that - the diet mentality is so common and accepted that you can't hide from it. There's this whole cultural narrative that people who lose weight are heroes, that they've won the fight against food. But food is not the enemy. It's really important that you find the reasons you're so scared of gaining weight, and work on them. It might feel impossible, but I promise you that once you let go of the control, life gets so much better. Losing control doesn't mean "living irresponsibly". You can still make healthy choices, you can still take care of yourself. But it comes from a place of love and care, not of fear and punishment. That's a huge difference...!

 

If you need support, I'm thinking of putting together an intuitive eating group. I'm sure there would be discussion about eating disorders / disordered eating, too, and sharing our thoughts and ideas could really help everyone to work through their issues. I mean, I wasted so many years of my life being starved and scared around food that if I can help others work towards a healthier relationship with food, I'd love it to do it. This is just an invitation, though! Think about it

 

Sorry for taking over the thread, Arkania

[Tobbe]

21 minutes ago, Ensi said:

btw, handling your cravings with regular Oreos works with any kind of Oreos

 

That's great to hear! Does it work for cookies in general, too? 

 

22 minutes ago, Ensi said:

I thought that weight gain == social abandonment, loneliness, and being seen as lazy and bad.

 

Yes! This! Especially the "lazy and bad" part.

[Arkania]

Just a quick hello

I was very busy last week and from friday on laying in bed with a cold.

Now I am having breakfast and will then drive to my family to make some apple juice with them. So I am not sure, if I just be dead and go to bed when I am back home this evening, so I will post today or tomorrow morning an update

[Tobbe]

She's alive! 

[Jett]

Oh, I hope that you are feeling better.

Are you making apple juice from scratch??

[Tobbe]

13 minutes ago, Jett said:

Are you making apple juice from scratch??

 

Any other way to make it?  

 

I mean, either you make it on your own, and then it is from scratch. Or you buy it already pressed for you. What are the "in-between" options?

[Mad Hatter]

Feel better soon!

[Arkania]

A quick status before I read aaaaaaaaaaaaall the threads and posts and everything
Last week I was busy thinking about a website, a domain for it, working, do aaaaall the to dos, reading a lot of Coelho's books. And then friday came and I got really sick.

BF went to Luxembourg fri-sat night. I was feeling not thaaat good on friday, runny nose, but it was okay-ish.

And Saturday: In my face

I tried to learn (Rosetta) and tried to do aaaaall the todos but my brain was so foggy I ended up doing everything but nothing really good

So on sunday I thought: Ok, you'll stay in bed! In the morning cluster headache hit me for about two hours (that's something I wouldn't wish on an enemy....) and the rest of the day was blergh. Reading, Netflix, ordering thai food. Done.

But: I was feeling okay-ish yesterday, so I went to the "family mansion", had some Aspirin Complex and then we made apple juice. Sure from scratch
My uncle has some fields and properties with apple trees on it, so they went picking apples the week before and we "just" had to ... ähm... crush? them and press them out.

After that we heated it up the juice and put it into bottles.

Here are some photos (almost forgot them, so no great shots )

My job most of the time was it, to crank the crank (...?) for apple crushing, so my right forearm and elbow hurt reaaaally bad today.

 

 

I had some findings last week:
- I can't have sweets at home, that are mine. Period.

- Fall/Winter time is time to chill, sleep a lot, do all the cozy things (I am an autumn/summer person)

 

@Tobbe The green investment podcast was sort of a bank promotional event in my opinion...

 

I am still sick but feeling better today. I could go to the doctor and get a sick note (then I'd get my vacation back this week at work), but I don't feel like sitting in the waiting room there.

And now I will read through the posts

[Arkania]

Oh and I had a little binge thing. And therefore the finding is: No sweets in the house

[Arkania]

On 10/24/2018 at 7:02 AM, Ensi said:

... and now I remember that when I stopped obsessing over food, I needed to find other sources of pleasure in my life. I had to start listening to what I wanted in my life outside of "fitness". So, start finding life and interests outside fitness and losing weight! (Maybe you already have, but my life was pretty dull back then - I thought about food and losing weight constantly...)

 

I think about drawing again. Just a bit doodeling maybe.

 

Oh, and another finding: I switch between routine and no routine-times. So sometimes it's nice to live just as life goes but there are times I need sort of routines.

And with routines I don't mean "a big to do list" And habits are great for bad times. I read a quote last week... sort of... "self-determined routine is true freedom".  (Book: Gate C30)
And (that were exactly my thoughts all the time): routine unequal monotony

 

 

[Arkania]

On 10/26/2018 at 4:00 PM, Ensi said:

Sorry for taking over the thread, Arkania

 

No problem at all, you can discuss here.
I like it, when this thread is good for others and is alive even without me

[Arkania]

Oh, song for today:

 

[Arkania]

Ok, and another one for the time I wasn't here

 

 

[Tobbe]

5 hours ago, Arkania said:

so I went to the "family mansion"

 

Sounds like a nice time with family   And freshly pressed apple juice is soo good 

 

5 hours ago, Arkania said:

- I can't have sweets at home, that are mine. Period.

4 hours ago, Arkania said:

And therefore the finding is: No sweets in the house

 

I feel the same way... I'll just end up eating it all! But that's not how I want it to be. I want to be able to have candy in the cupboard, and not even think about it. And if I get a candy craving, I should be able to have just one or a few pieces and then be satisfied and not have any more. There shouldn't have to be some rule about "no sweets"! Hopefully I (we) can get there some day  

[Tobbe]

Thanks for the   Needed something to pump me up! 

[Arkania]

6 minutes ago, Tobbe said:

Thanks for the   Needed something to pump me up! 

 

Here you are, a whole set

 

 

[Tobbe]

Found this that I thought was pretty great!

 

 

(Sorry about the stupid video - try to focus on the song)

[Arkania]

2 hours ago, Tobbe said:

Found this that I thought was pretty great!

 

 

(Sorry about the stupid video - try to focus on the song)

 

 

Yeah, I posted it some time ago

 

[Tobbe]

4 hours ago, Arkania said:

Yeah, I posted it some time ago

 

Haha, alright then... 

[Arkania]

So, yesterday Tobbe talked me into the NF Academy Membership (btw I also got the mail!), at the moment there is a "holiday bundle" where you get the Membership + NF Yoga with a great discount.

So I did the starting quests yesterday (measurements, photos, mindset stuff....) and the starting workout level (3).

I am still a bit sick, so I will start the workouts next week and will see what other quests I can do this week.