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10 hours ago, KB Girl said:

She did steal my hoody for warmth.

 

Excellent choice! :D

 

1 hour ago, Scalyfreak said:

legal and financial benefits to legally married couples that other partnerships don't offer

 

This! Some law student ranting in the spoiler.


 

Spoiler

 

Up until last year, I also was firm in my belief that a paper/legal status wouldn't add anything to my relationship. But then I was convinced the family law/inheritance law is TERRIBLE for people informally living together. Even in the NL where it's pretty much accepted. 

 

(You also have a marriage or a "registered partnership" that are legally basically the same - RP is the marriage the Dutch legislator thought of for same-sex couples. In 2001 same-sex marriage was legalised... but it turned out lots of people wanted a "marriage" that isn't called a marriage so it still is a thing.)

 

So if you ever have the brain space and some euros to spare - especially because you 2 have kids AND are business owners - I would ask for legal council. Especially the inheritance/schenkingen (family & fiscal) aspect! Check it out. It's very much worth it, even for people with only a house as a property and owning a business adds another flavour to the mix. 

 

ALSO, fun fact, if you ever have to testify in court, you have no right to remain silent. If you're legal spouses, however, you cannot be made to testify against Jaap or vice versa. :D but that's just a fun fact. Hope it is never needed haha

 

EDIT: this is obviously from my perspective after being shown all the gaps & also, I'm not comparing it to any other legal systems. Just saying the course lectures changed my perspective :) 

 

1 hour ago, starsapart said:

there are also some pretty nice tax benefits. 😋

 

Dutch tax law is actually pretty cool for non-married couples. :) 

 

Ahhh, catching up on your thread was fun. I also read that people with bare feet get used to it, even in city areas. One article said something like "there aren't as many drug needles to step on as I thought" :DSorry you had a rough patch but you & you and Jaap rock!

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4 minutes ago, analoggirl said:

Dutch tax law is actually pretty cool for non-married couples. :)

 

Oh, I'm not saying for her, I'm saying for me, it was a serious consideration. US tax law is very biased toward married couples, which is one of the (many) reasons that we fought so hard for same-sex marriage, as scaly mentioned above. For me personally, the annual loss in taxes before we were allowed to get married legally was well over $7,000. At the time, that was a solid fifth of my income, so it was really pretty crucial to plug that hole.

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10 hours ago, KB Girl said:

(we’re not married actually 😅 living in sin, we are)
 

Then I misspoke as well; spouse is the gender neutral term for the person to whom one is married. Partners would have been more appropriate for me to use.

10 hours ago, KB Girl said:

Thank you! We’re definitely trying to be extra considerate and succeeding most of the time. I like the “y’all”s :) 
 

Aww shucks ma'am, 't'weren't nuthin.

10 hours ago, KB Girl said:

32A709AD-0FA8-476A-AD86-C1DF5F0F6950.thumb.jpeg.e15fef3b57ec7bd65d5201bf6e0f6ae9.jpeg

She looks like a Jawa!

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31 minutes ago, starsapart said:

was

 

That's great, because that's sorted now. What. A. Difference. Damn...

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1 hour ago, Scalyfreak said:

 

The US provides legal and financial benefits to legally married couples that other partnerships don't offer (that's why same-sex marriage is such a big deal). I personally know at least three couples who cite tax benefits or health insurance as the main reason they decided to marry each other, and two of the three are very open they would not have married if not for those reasons. That seems somehow wrong to me... to me, whether a couple gets married or live as life partners without the party and the piece of paper, should be entirely their decision, and not influenced by a need for healthcare or money.

 

Obviously. That posture is pure Sith.

Right?! :D

I didn’t know this, makes me even happier that same sex marriage is now an option for y’all. It wasn’t a factor for us. We briefly reconsidered marriage when I was pregnant the first time, but in the end the only difference it would make was automatically acknowledging Jaap as the father. But the paperwork for that was only 5 minutes work in our current situation. 

 

1 hour ago, starsapart said:

 

I suppose so, but all those caring for each other and building a life together things really fall into the life partnership column anyway. Then again, I'm not religious in that sense.

 

I suppose on top of the paper and the party, there are also some pretty nice tax benefits. 😋 Maybe that's the main reason we tied the knot?

well yes, with that kind of tax benefit id get that piece of paper too! 
Also maybe since it was such a struggle for equal rights it is also a thing to make use of those rights?

 

1 hour ago, analoggirl said:

 

This! Some law student ranting in the spoiler.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Up until last year, I also was firm in my belief that a paper/legal status wouldn't add anything to my relationship. But then I was convinced the family law/inheritance law is TERRIBLE for people informally living together. Even in the NL where it's pretty much accepted. 

 

(You also have a marriage or a "registered partnership" that are legally basically the same - RP is the marriage the Dutch legislator thought of for same-sex couples. In 2001 same-sex marriage was legalised... but it turned out lots of people wanted a "marriage" that isn't called a marriage so it still is a thing.)

 

So if you ever have the brain space and some euros to spare - especially because you 2 have kids AND are business owners - I would ask for legal council. Especially the inheritance/schenkingen (family & fiscal) aspect! Check it out. It's very much worth it, even for people with only a house as a property and owning a business adds another flavour to the mix. 

 

ALSO, fun fact, if you ever have to testify in court, you have no right to remain silent. If you're legal spouses, however, you cannot be made to testify against Jaap or vice versa. :D but that's just a fun fact. Hope it is never needed haha

 

EDIT: this is obviously from my perspective after being shown all the gaps & also, I'm not comparing it to any other legal systems. Just saying the course lectures changed my perspective :) 

 

Dutch tax law is actually pretty cool for non-married couples. :) 

 

Ahhh, catching up on your thread was fun. I also read that people with bare feet get used to it, even in city areas. One article said something like "there aren't as many drug needles to step on as I thought" :DSorry you had a rough patch but you & you and Jaap rock!

thank you! :) 

if we were ever to buy a house or have a business that is worth something material then we’d look into getting some legal counsel. I think for now we’re good.
 

50 minutes ago, Tanktimus the Encourager said:

Then I misspoke as well; spouse is the gender neutral term for the person to whom one is married. Partners would have been more appropriate for me to use.

Aww shucks ma'am, 't'weren't nuthin.

She looks like a Jawa!

This might be the first time I’ve hoped that us not getting married doesn’t make someone think less of me 🤭 probably a silly thought, but there it is.

And I really don’t mind the terminology either way, (well I dislike partner but that’s because of dutch-word associations), it’s just that I don’t want to falsely claim something. It might not matter to me, but I know it’s an important distinction for others. 

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16 minutes ago, KB Girl said:

I didn’t know this, makes me even happier that same sex marriage is now an option for y’all.

 

The biggest offender for us was health insurance. Basically, my company was "progressive" and allowed me to cover my same-sex domestic partner, but by federal law, they were not able to deduct healthcare expenses pre-tax except for a married spouse, so they were counted as income, I was taxed on it, and basically had to pay 1.5x the amount to cover the taxes on the coverage, which as I think I've mentioned before can get very expensive here even if it isn't very good. It was some serious BS.

 

20 minutes ago, KB Girl said:

Also maybe since it was such a struggle for equal rights it is also a thing to make use of those rights?

 

Yes, this too. I wanted to get married for more than just financial reasons - it was a way of saying, "my relationship is valid and equal to anyone else's long-term relationship," and even if some people don't believe that's true (still.... sigh), it still made me feel better.

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Wednesday was pretty good. Jaap and I only had to work an hour each. I walked the dog for 45 minutes, with Sophie in a sling, which got me pretty sweaty. I went grocery shopping and I cooked. That’s about it 🤷‍♀️

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2 hours ago, KB Girl said:

This might be the first time I’ve hoped that us not getting married doesn’t make someone think less of me 🤭 probably a silly thought, but there it is.

 

If it ever does, that says a lot more about them than it does about you. :) 

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3 hours ago, KB Girl said:

This might be the first time I’ve hoped that us not getting married doesn’t make someone think less of me 🤭 probably a silly thought, but there it is.

And I really don’t mind the terminology either way, (well I dislike partner but that’s because of dutch-word associations), it’s just that I don’t want to falsely claim something. It might not matter to me, but I know it’s an important distinction for others.

I'm glad you said that thought out loud, because now I can assure you finding out you aren't married on paper does not change my opinion of you at all. I also totally get your integrity compelling you to be truthful.

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She looks like a Jawa!

LOL. I Was just about to look for a Jawa picture to post.

 

ETA My family health insurance costs went down about $600/month when I switched from domestic partnership to married. I have no idea why, but we would have gotten married years earlier had we known.

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9 hours ago, starsapart said:

US tax law is very biased toward married couples, which is one of the (many) reasons that we fought so hard for same-sex marriage, as scaly mentioned above. For me personally, the annual loss in taxes before we were allowed to get married legally was well over $7,000. At the time, that was a solid fifth of my income, so it was really pretty crucial to plug that hole.

I am really glad that I came over and read this.  The news apparently did a very poor job of explaining the difference between marriage and domestic partnerships or whatever they were calling the non-marriage version.  I had thought that the treatment under the law was the same as marriage and that the only difference was semantical (because people didn't like the word "marriage" being used for same sex relationships for some reason).  Thanks for educating me on this

 

8 hours ago, Tanktimus the Encourager said:

She looks like a Jawa!

My first reaction was that she looks like a Jedi, but after reading your comment I agree with you 

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8 hours ago, starsapart said:

 

Yes, this too. I wanted to get married for more than just financial reasons - it was a way of saying, "my relationship is valid and equal to anyone else's long-term relationship," and even if some people don't believe that's true (still.... sigh), it still made me feel better.

Yes this makes perfect sense to me!

 

6 hours ago, Scalyfreak said:

 

If it ever does, that says a lot more about them than it does about you. :) 

Oh yes well... I don’t know. It could be a subconscious thing. I don’t hold it against older (80+) dutch people for having that ingrained, for example. 
 

5 hours ago, Tanktimus the Encourager said:

I'm glad you said that thought out loud, because now I can assure you finding out you aren't married on paper does not change my opinion of you at all. I also totally get your integrity compelling you to be truthful.

thanks :) the other reason I said it out loud is because I find it very interesting that apparently i care enough about your opinion to worry about it. NF is a special place. And you are pretty special too 😌

 

2 hours ago, Sloth the Enduring said:

LOL. I Was just about to look for a Jawa picture to post.

 

ETA My family health insurance costs went down about $600/month when I switched from domestic partnership to married. I have no idea why, but we would have gotten married years earlier had we known.

Y’all just keep amazing me. My family health insurance is 270€ a month. I’m insured quite well, including travel things. 

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I WAS GOING TO SAY JAWA TOO. Mhahahha.

 

18 hours ago, KB Girl said:

"does it bother me enough that in english i'm stuck with either partner or boyfriend?" and the answer to both was no. And now I just call Jaap by his name on my thread x) 

Looool, perfect.

 

15 hours ago, KB Girl said:

Wednesday was pretty good. Jaap and I only had to work an hour each. I walked the dog for 45 minutes, with Sophie in a sling, which got me pretty sweaty. I went grocery shopping and I cooked. That’s about it 🤷‍♀️

THAT IS ALL GREAT THOUGH.

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7 hours ago, KB Girl said:

thanks :) the other reason I said it out loud is because I find it very interesting that apparently i care enough about your opinion to worry about it. NF is a special place. And you are pretty special too 😌

I'm flattered. 

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I think in some places, being married also gives you legal rights like visiting someone in the hospital and deciding on their medical care if they're unconscious? But yeah, there are benefits and protections because you're a family, and the family is a protected unit according to the humans rights conventions we all signed. Obviously I don't believe in 'sin' so I have no religious motives for preferring marriage. In my case it was legally necessary. But it also gave our families a chance to celebrate, and for us to think about what we were deciding on. So it's not just a piece of paper. I'm super glad that Germany and Australia have made gay marriage into law, and it was my very great satisfaction to vote in favour on my country's annoying non-binding survey. But they did in fact honour the results, so it's okay.

 

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8 minutes ago, Harriet said:

I think in some places, being married also gives you legal rights like visiting someone in the hospital and deciding on their medical care if they're unconscious?

 

There's also the financial side of joint ownership of assets, automatically inheriting if one of the two die, the legal right to refuse to testify in court against a spouse, and a few others. Also the immigration side of things.

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On 5/20/2020 at 3:09 PM, KB Girl said:

Oh please don't apologise! I 100% don't mind. It actually made me laugh because I remembered having a conversation on my challenge thread years ago questioning wether I should go ahead and marry Jaap or not. Because i'm not religious it ended up being a "do i want an excuse for a party?" and "does it bother me enough that in english i'm stuck with either partner or boyfriend?" and the answer to both was no. And now I just call Jaap by his name on my thread x) 

I think I remember this discussion because having to say "boyfriend" can sometimes sound immature, even though it is truthful. Which I think is silly but 🤷‍♀️ (J and I will be together for 8 years next month, unmarried) 

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3 hours ago, miss_marissa said:

I think I remember this discussion because having to say "boyfriend" can sometimes sound immature, even though it is truthful.

 

A lot of the non-married fully committed couples I know refer to each other as partner, or life partner.  Personally I like that term a lot more. It's a more accurate description of the relationship.

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16 hours ago, Scalyfreak said:

A lot of the non-married fully committed couples I know refer to each other as partner, or life partner.  Personally I like that term a lot more. It's a more accurate description of the relationship.

Agreed, even though I also still have the tendency to say "boyfriend" in English (we've been together for 10 years now). We haven't married because it is a lot of hassle for basically just a big party, as we wouldn't have any other benefit from it at the moment. We do have some kind of "contract" from a notary that basically states what happens when one of us dies or if we break up. I think this has almost all the same rights as marriage as long as we don't have children. 

 

On 5/21/2020 at 4:41 PM, Harriet said:

I think in some places, being married also gives you legal rights like visiting someone in the hospital and deciding on their medical care if they're unconscious?

This is exactly one of the reasons why we went to the notary ;). Together with it being relatively cheap, it being a responsible thing to do and not wanting to cause possible fights with in-laws over stuff if one of us died. Whenever you own a house, or even a joint car, I think you should have something to protect you legally from having to give it up to others if your partner dies.

 

I didn't know that in the US, the marriage-thing is so important in a financial sense! If it would be as big here, we would have married ages ago.

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On 5/22/2020 at 12:19 AM, miss_marissa said:

I think I remember this discussion because having to say "boyfriend" can sometimes sound immature, even though it is truthful. Which I think is silly but 🤷‍♀️ (J and I will be together for 8 years next month, unmarried) 

Yes, exactly! 8 years already :) boyfriend does not sound right. 

 

On 5/22/2020 at 4:02 AM, Scalyfreak said:

A lot of the non-married fully committed couples I know refer to each other as partner, or life partner.  Personally I like that term a lot more. It's a more accurate description of the relationship.

To me it sounds too business like.. but yes it is an accurate description. 

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8 minutes ago, KB Girl said:

 

To me it sounds too business like.. but yes it is an accurate description. 

 

Well, I constantly throw people off by referring to Husband as my best friend, or my lover, just as often as I refer to him as my better half or my chosen life partner, and even occasionally my husband, so my opinion on how couples refer to each other isn't exactly the norm :) 

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Thursday was a special day. It's a holiday in the Netherlands where it's tradition to go cycle outside, watch the sunrise.. and if you're young drink lots and lots of alcohol xD 

For me it's a little extra special because it marks the anniversary (8th this year) of that time I didn't die from meningitis. It's a good moment to give a bit of thought to the fact that lots of people I know wouldn't still be alive (or be born) if it weren't for the wonders of modern medicine. 

 

In the morning we went by bike to the park where Jaap gave his body control lesson (all the handstands) and in the afternoon we went for a longer hike + picknick and in the evening we had dinner with my family in my brothers garden. It was all around lovely. 

 

Friday I had a really full class for the morning strength training and miraculously I also had a new person who immediately signed a contract. My mind was blown. My sister also joined the class and left my nephew with Jaap- so he had 3 kids. Jaap is awesome. I let him take a nap when I got home. I also did some paper work and laundry and general housekeeping, so a pretty good day on paper. 

 

Saturday I had three 1on1's (outside) which all went well. I went home in between to make my boobs available. Jaap and I also recorded a sort of podcast thing, which we may or may not publish, but we did the thing and it wasn't horrible. Jaap also seems to be doing a bit better again, he trained for the first time in 10 weeks and he just got home from visiting with 2 friends (outside). I am immensely glad. 

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13 minutes ago, KB Girl said:

For me it's a little extra special because it marks the anniversary (8th this year) of that time I didn't die from meningitis. It's a good moment to give a bit of thought to the fact that lots of people I know wouldn't still be alive (or be born) if it weren't for the wonders of modern medicine. 

 

I'm pretty sure I speak for all of us when I say we are very happy you didn't die. :) 

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Yep, glad you didn't die. With this pandemic, I've been thinking  about how wonderful modern medicine is. So many diseases that people used to worry about , now are almost nonexistent. 

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