[Mad Hatter] Braaaains for breakfast

[Mad Hatter]

18 hours ago, tei_ said:

Ahhh, I'm sorry to hear you're struggling. I Highly Identify with the "what would I like to do? idk, probably nothing" feeling right now. I have nothing to offer on the therapy front (hahaha i went to one therapist once and it was terrible and awkward and I ghosted him after two sessions) but it sounds like you're putting in work to find something that will help.

Thanks.  Yeah unfortunately a lot of people are struggling with those thoughts right now... 

Terrible and awkward is a good way to describe my session too.  We'll see how much I can take haha. It's worth a shot.

[KB Girl]

I've read the largest predictor of success in therapy is wether or not you click with your therapist. I'll add to the positive noises about therapy, it worked well for me way back when, but it was for a specific problem (PTSD), I reckon it's much harder with something not so easy to define.. where do you even start? 

It's awesome you're giving it a chance though  I'd say argue away, you need to figure out if you can respect this person, I suspect arguing with someone is one of your ways of finding out what they're like? 

[Epsilonte]

2 hours ago, KB Girl said:

I've read the largest predictor of success in therapy is wether or not you click with your therapist.

 

This is actually one of the first things we learned in physiotherapy school. (Very different kind of therapy, but still similar in this aspect.  If it's this way for the body, it most definitely is this way with the mind as well... )

[Scaly Freak]

2 hours ago, KB Girl said:

I've read the largest predictor of success in therapy is wether or not you click with your therapist. 

 

This makes perfect sense to me. The clicking facilitates trust.

[Athena]

Makes sense! I suppose that has to do with that trust/expectation factor. When there is that "click", it is much easier to understand one another, because I suspect your non-verbal language is on the same wavelength, and when some spot on observations are made a few times, you have that positive experience. Next time there is a misunderstanding or so, you don't assume it is because this therapist is not for you, but maybe he/she does not have all datapoints or so  

 

The coach I am talking with, the sessions even had a therapeutic quality for me,

 

but so do the talks on NF often,

 

I open up, knowing there is a culture of genuinely wanting to help each other here, amongst people that have enough life experience and self-reflection and an ability to share the principles of what they learnt, and point it out when they can't.

 

With a therapist you might have the feeling he/she is just doing his thing for self-interest ("it's his job") or from a place as if he/she knows more about you than you do, in the bad sense.

 

This coach I have, she had been through so many functions, including teaching positions, and she clearly has a higher purpose she openly shares. She has had a big traumatic event and now she is wanting to apply her skills to help people. And her skills and experience shows: she asks the right open questions, empowering,

 

she eased my mind when I started being apologetic in a way I had not been before, and generally just opened up ways for me to communicate to her what's up,

 

and she looked at my expressions when she started making observations, even when I started nodding, she asked if those were words I would have used as well, and that act of reflection helped too.

 

She also seems like she would be able to handle an argumentative person well, because when there was that bit about my report, she made it clear what's up without sounding apologetic herself, (I think there is a difference between showing regret/sorry/recognising a mistake and being all apologetic, like I sometimes have those overlapping even though the apologeticness is not necessary, maybe except for people who need to see someone squirm before they believe an apology ) or defensive.

 

It's part click, part having that balance between really wanting to help and being firm & flexible (like water , with experience you probably also learn how to do that *genuinely* with your non-verbal language ) It's no easy task...

 

Ahh I hope you meet someone that you click with

[Athena]

17 hours ago, Mad Hatter said:

Involuntary body reactions are very annoying.  

THEY ARE

[tei_]

22 hours ago, Epsilonte said:

This is actually one of the first things we learned in physiotherapy school. (Very different kind of therapy, but still similar in this aspect.  If it's this way for the body, it most definitely is this way with the mind as well... )

 

Ah, this is super interesting! I mean, it makes sense, but it would be easy to overlook the importance of trust and comfort when it's "just" (LOL) something physical.

[WhiteGhost]

I don't have anything to add on the therapy discussion but just stopping by to say hi and that I commiserate with the "what do I even want to do with my life" feels

[Harriet]

Just swooping in to say heyy and I hope the brain work goes well.

... I didn't get much out of therapy until I started being more honest with myself/her, which, um, took ages. 

[Mad Hatter]

On 11/6/2020 at 11:05 PM, KB Girl said:

I've read the largest predictor of success in therapy is wether or not you click with your therapist. I'll add to the positive noises about therapy, it worked well for me way back when, but it was for a specific problem (PTSD), I reckon it's much harder with something not so easy to define.. where do you even start? 

It's awesome you're giving it a chance though  I'd say argue away, you need to figure out if you can respect this person, I suspect arguing with someone is one of your ways of finding out what they're like? 

Makes sense!

 

LOL maybe it is.  

 

On 11/7/2020 at 1:23 AM, Epsilonte said:

This is actually one of the first things we learned in physiotherapy school. (Very different kind of therapy, but still similar in this aspect.  If it's this way for the body, it most definitely is this way with the mind as well... )

That's so interesting that it's being taught this way, do you know for how long that's been the case? I'm wondering because my physio friend has a similar take on this, but I don't know if she's ever been taught that. She doesn't really believe that she's doing anything when she's treating someone. Most of the time the body heals itself, and the only thing that she does is really to provide comfort and simply to let people talk about their issues. Yes, she's poking around and testing and diagnosing, but the efficacy is mostly, or at least close to, placebo (not to mention that treatment modalities lose efficacy over time depending on how trending it is). Most of her job is reducing stress (through touch, assuring them the pain will improve, and, here I'm guessing, simply by taking time out of the day to focus on themselves) in order for the body to do its thing.

 

On 11/7/2020 at 9:37 AM, Aθena said:

but so do the talks on NF often,

 

I open up, knowing there is a culture of genuinely wanting to help each other here, amongst people that have enough life experience and self-reflection and an ability to share the principles of what they learnt, and point it out when they can't.

Same! 

 

23 hours ago, Harriet said:

Just swooping in to say heyy and I hope the brain work goes well.

... I didn't get much out of therapy until I started being more honest with myself/her, which, um, took ages. 

Yay, so good to see you! Will you stay/challenge? Missed having you around!

 

Makes sense. I'm ok with being honest, but only when there's a direct question. Otherwise I have a tendency to not lie, but to only disclose a snippet of the thought jumble. Which probably equates to the same thing in the end...

[Epsilonte]

20 minutes ago, Mad Hatter said:

That's so interesting that it's being taught this way, do you know for how long that's been the case? I'm wondering because my physio friend has a similar take on this, but I don't know if she's ever been taught that. She doesn't really believe that she's doing anything when she's treating someone. Most of the time the body heals itself, and the only thing that she does is really to provide comfort and simply to let people talk about their issues. Yes, she's poking around and testing and diagnosing, but the efficacy is mostly, or at least close to, placebo (not to mention that treatment modalities lose efficacy over time depending on how trending it is). Most of her job is reducing stress (through touch, assuring them the pain will improve, and, here I'm guessing, simply by taking time out of the day to focus on themselves) in order for the body to do its thing.

 

Hmmmm, that is the gist of it. xD I don't know how long it has been taught this way, but that's exactly how it is. It's also really interesting that very often things that look horrible on an MRT image don't hurt the patient and often joints that look (and feel) fine do hurt... One of our teachers said something like: if you want to make sure that your patient's pain is turnig chronic, show them their MRT images. 

Well, some parts of physio therapy are useful as well - like moving joints of patients that can't move on their own and stuff like this. Not everything is just a placebo.  

[Mad Hatter]

Not much on the goal update front, time keeps slipping by me and I forget! 

On Saturday it was because I hung out with friends all day. The weather was meh so we just ate and drank. It was great. 

On Sunday I meant to do something productive, buuuut then I ended up playing a game, which was not that great (the game, not the gaming).

 

Today I had my follow up doctor's appointment and it turns out that my vitamin D is a bit low (despite supplementing most days), and my iron is very low (my blood values are good though) so with some of luck things could potentially perk up with a bit of supplementation.  And now I know that I don't have anything like thyroid or inflammation issues lurking.

 

Today I also went to the gym! It's been a while again and I was feeling extremely heavy and demotivated. So I only stayed for about half an hour, haphazardly touching holds.  Even so it was good to get going again. The nice thing I discovered is that the spray wall has been reset with many more accessible holds and there's more options for me now. Especially on the steep section which was pretty much untouchable earlier.  

[Mad Hatter]

10 minutes ago, Epsilonte said:

One of our teachers said something like: if you want to make sure that your patient's pain is turnig chronic, show them their MRT images. 

That's brilliant.  And really goes to show how important the way you communicate with your patient is. There's tremendous amount of power in that. 

 

12 minutes ago, Epsilonte said:

Well, some parts of physio therapy are useful as well - like moving joints of patients that can't move on their own and stuff like this. Not everything is just a placebo.  

Very true, I was thinking mainly of the physios treating mainly office worker/weekend warriors kind of people.  Some physios really do an amazing job helping people walk and speak again and stuff like that, and also with pain management. In any case, just because a treatment is mostly placebo it doesn't mean that it's not effective! It's only an issue when the treatment is very costly and/or invasive, like surgery. In my opinion, clearly surgeons disagree.  

 

I'm guessing you'll want to specialize in dance/pole? Or do you have something else in mind?

[Epsilonte]

1 hour ago, Mad Hatter said:

That's brilliant.  And really goes to show how important the way you communicate with your patient is. There's tremendous amount of power in that. 

 

Ooooh yes, there really is! Soooo important. That's why we are talking about it now, at the very start of the three years. 

 

1 hour ago, Mad Hatter said:

I'm guessing you'll want to specialize in dance/pole? Or do you have something else in mind?

 

Haha great question... xD That was my intention when I applied to the school in February... But who knows what will happen in the next three years?  Maybe I fall in love with teaching people how to walk or hold a spoon again. We will see.  The original plan was to maybe some day move to Scandinavia (it's just way too warm in Summer in Vienna ) and open a little pole/physio studio there.  

I can also see myself in my own little space somewhere in the country side... Like a witch, but with more of a background in conventional medicine.  

[Athena]

47 minutes ago, Epsilonte said:

open a little pole/physio studio there.  

 

Interesting! I was really enjoying the physio/pilates combination. I like that people are combining physiotherapy with other things. It seems like a good interdisciplinary match, too.

 

47 minutes ago, Epsilonte said:

I can also see myself in my own little space somewhere in the country side... Like a witch, but with more of a background in conventional medicine.  

 

Hey, stereotypical witches of yore were the forerunners in their field back then! Instead of going at illnesses with just prayers and the gal/blood/etc. balance or what was it?

 

(I know what you mean, just what came to mind when you said that haha)

[Epsilonte]

12 hours ago, Aθena said:

Hey, stereotypical witches of yore were the forerunners in their field back then! Instead of going at illnesses with just prayers and the gal/blood/etc. balance or what was it?

 

(I know what you mean, just what came to mind when you said that haha)

 

Yeah, now it's conventional medicine, back then it was magic. I really feel like I'm learning how to heal people with my hands right now. Love it.  Also all the touching and palpating where you can really feel how somebodys joints and muscles and bones are behaving... It is kinda magic.  

 

14 hours ago, Mad Hatter said:

Today I also went to the gym! It's been a while again and I was feeling extremely heavy and demotivated. So I only stayed for about half an hour, haphazardly touching holds.  Even so it was good to get going again. The nice thing I discovered is that the spray wall has been reset with many more accessible holds and there's more options for me now. Especially on the steep section which was pretty much untouchable earlier.  

 

The most important step is showing up.  

[Harriet]

20 hours ago, Mad Hatter said:

Yay, so good to see you! Will you stay/challenge? Missed having you around!

 

Thanks! I'm not challenging this time, because I'm having an attempted low internet phase, but I will next time. I will pop in now and then. 

 

20 hours ago, Mad Hatter said:

Makes sense. I'm ok with being honest, but only when there's a direct question. Otherwise I have a tendency to not lie, but to only disclose a snippet of the thought jumble. Which probably equates to the same thing in the end...

 

I guess I wasn't even being honest with myself, which is a prerequisite for knowing what really needs to be talked about... either way, one doesn't necessarily easily get straight to the core of the thing that must be discussed.

[Scaly Freak]

On 11/8/2020 at 10:27 AM, Harriet said:

... I didn't get much out of therapy until I started being more honest with myself/her, which, um, took ages. 

 

This is one of the main reasons therapy isn't for everyone. It's like quitting smoking - all the great techniques and treatments in the world are worthless if the smoker doesn't genuinely want to quit. If a person is not ready to be open and honest and with themselves and with the therapist/counselor, therapy is nothing but a conversation where one of the parties is trying to get information and the other is (intentionally or not) trying to hide it. 

[KB Girl]

On 11/9/2020 at 7:17 PM, Mad Hatter said:

Today I had my follow up doctor's appointment and it turns out that my vitamin D is a bit low (despite supplementing most days), and my iron is very low (my blood values are good though) so with some of luck things could potentially perk up with a bit of supplementation.  And now I know that I don't have anything like thyroid or inflammation issues lurking.

 

This is hopeful  

 

On 11/9/2020 at 6:38 PM, Mad Hatter said:

That's so interesting that it's being taught this way, do you know for how long that's been the case? I'm wondering because my physio friend has a similar take on this, but I don't know if she's ever been taught that. She doesn't really believe that she's doing anything when she's treating someone. Most of the time the body heals itself, and the only thing that she does is really to provide comfort and simply to let people talk about their issues. Yes, she's poking around and testing and diagnosing, but the efficacy is mostly, or at least close to, placebo (not to mention that treatment modalities lose efficacy over time depending on how trending it is). Most of her job is reducing stress (through touch, assuring them the pain will improve, and, here I'm guessing, simply by taking time out of the day to focus on themselves) in order for the body to do its thing.

 

Very interesting! reminds me of that time last year that we spoke about pain and that placebo surgery, do you remember?

There is this really cool physio, Antony Lo, who talks about this subject a lot specifically concerning women's issues. He has good youtube videos if you're ever bored. 

[raptron]

On 11/9/2020 at 1:17 PM, Mad Hatter said:

Today I had my follow up doctor's appointment and it turns out that my vitamin D is a bit low (despite supplementing most days), and my iron is very low (my blood values are good though) so with some of luck things could potentially perk up with a bit of supplementation.  And now I know that I don't have anything like thyroid or inflammation issues lurking.

I was iron deficient for a while (which was pretty much because I donated blood every 2 months for like 2 years) and the the fatigue changes when I was properly IRONED UP were huuuge. 

 

On 11/9/2020 at 1:17 PM, Mad Hatter said:

Today I also went to the gym! It's been a while again and I was feeling extremely heavy and demotivated. So I only stayed for about half an hour, haphazardly touching holds.  Even so it was good to get going again. The nice thing I discovered is that the spray wall has been reset with many more accessible holds and there's more options for me now. Especially on the steep section which was pretty much untouchable earlier.  

OOo, that is exciting.

[Elastigirl]

Yay for getting to the gym.

 

I bet supplementing with more Vitamin D and with iron will help your energy

[@mu]

What's up Hatter?

[Mad Hatter]

On 11/30/2020 at 8:42 AM, @mu said:

What's up Hatter?

I... I got sucked into the death vortex of doom. I really wish I had something more positive to contribute, so I've been staying away. Now I'm just exhausted and so very clueless. 

Sorry for the gloom, but I really appreciate you checking in.

[tei_]

Understandable! I hope the vortex spits you out soon.

[Elastigirl]

1 hour ago, Mad Hatter said:

I... I got sucked into the death vortex of doom. I really wish I had something more positive to contribute, so I've been staying away. Now I'm just exhausted and so very clueless. 

Sorry for the gloom, but I really appreciate you checking in.

No reason to apologize. Just know that we are here for you when you are ready to check in.