MAJOR FORUM UPDATES THREAD!

[zeroh13]

1 hour ago, Scaly Freak said:

 

How will that work for someone who wants to be a Ranger in how they exercise, but prefers the more laid-back culture of the Druids? Do we need to avoid naming the general threads after guilds?

Why exactly would we need to avoid naming treads in the accountabilibuddy forum after guilds?

And what would be stopping someone from joining a thread meant to capture a guild’s culture when their exercise goals are more in line with a different guild? If this is someone who would join a guild primarily because of its culture, how is joining a thread like this any different?

[Sciread77]

1 hour ago, zeroh13 said:

With the fear of losing the guild subcultures, I think we could consider using the accountabilibuddies forum to preserve that. As I understand it, that forum was meant as a place for smaller groups of likeminded people to come together. So, why not use that? Make a thread where the monks can come together. Or the scouts. Or any of the other guilds.

It would be a simple solution that works with this new way of organizing challenges. Does this sound like a reasonable one?

 

IF parallels were set up that would work well. I get the grouping of similar goals along with the other issues and even reclaiming the guilds. I don’t know anything about the accountabilibuddies other than it’s there. Is it set up to have challenge threads? Can our GLs create subforums for us there? Because that’d be great. 
 

The forums evolved far and away beyond the original book and everything else a long time ago.  I get needing to restructure and change things up but I think the culture that grew from the original idea was far more valuable than that initial idea itself. The initial idea was a framework and includes a ton of incredibly smart, relevant information. The cultures grew out of years and years of people putting that information and framework into action.
 

The forum guilds look different from the original guild ideas  similar to how modern day birds are different from dinosaurs. I kinda feel like the initial changes where trying to force us modern birds back into the shapes of early dinosaurs. Maybe without a massive calamity it can also occupy all the niches. 

 

[Scaly Freak]

10 minutes ago, zeroh13 said:

Why exactly would we need to avoid naming treads in the accountabilibuddy forum after guilds?

 

Mainly to stay consistent. The Warriors are a weight lifting guild, and if the general Warrior chatter thread turns into  a few pages ' worth about the importance of meditation, that'll probably cause some confusion for someone who can to the thread in the hopes of finding advise on how to pick out a lifting belt. There is of course nothing stopping that person from posting and asking about a belt in the strength training forum, or in the Warrior thread, so it's not even close to a deal breaker or a problem. Just a concern.   

[sarakingdom]

3 hours ago, spezzy said:

1) When someone reads Steve's book, comes here from the Academy, talks about their guilds in the Prime FB Group, creates their character on the create your character tool, and decides they are a certain guild, our usage of them on the forums needs to match that. While these forums very often feel like they are completely on their own, we are still a part of NerdFitness. 

 

Totally understood. Absolutely, a necessary business move. And thank you for taking time to communicate on this, you do it well.

 

3 hours ago, spezzy said:

Sara - what you say about the Monks guild, with creating a virtual dojo and with virtual dojo rooms - I think that's fantastic, and I absolutely love it - but does this have to take place within the challenges?  We combined the forums because, to be completely transparent, we had ONE new thread created in the Martial Arts (or general Monk discussion) section  of the main forums in all of 2020.  So if we had that - why not build the Dojo there? Is there a reason it has to be exclusive to challenges? That way someone who isn't feeling up for a challenge can still participate in the general conversations, too, we can encourage and make them feel comfortable to take part in the future, and there would be more opportunity for resource threads to help everyone along when they do a challenge. 

 

There are definitely options, absolutely. Uniformity in the challenges to meet a business design need and wanting the guilds to find a new outlet or venue for the custom guild support is a different situation from the way it initially read, and much clearer picture of what's needed and wanted on the site.

 

To pose a question back, between this and the mention of running minichallenges being run in the endurance board, it looks like the subtext may be that you would like the guilds to somewhat formally take over and nurture their related boards as their home turf in order to drive activity there, and/or perhaps functionally merge the guild subforums with the related boards so that they merge those functions in the absence of guild subforums. Is that part of the goal? It isn't clear to me.

 

3 hours ago, spezzy said:

And with that - not all guilds have that with their challenges - I've gone in after a challenge has started and added the general chat threads because they didn't even have those because the GLs had no spoons - so that's what I'm talking about with offering everyone the same.

 

I mean, so have I, as a regular user. I've made the Monk general chat threads for maybe 30% of the past couple (five? a while, anyway) years of challenges, because the GLs had no spoons. And that's what I mean when I say everyone is offered the same. Making threads is available to all of us.

 

3 hours ago, spezzy said:

I agree, and I don't think anyone was trying to say that any member doesn't volunteer time, that anyone's time is more valuable, or that this community doesn't belong to the community.  I owe literally my entire life to this community - and that's not just the guild leaders, or NFHQ, or anything - it's the entire community.  We all play a vital role in this community - every single one of us.  

 

I just wanted to add another like to this. Thank you for saying it. ❤

[zeroh13]

4 minutes ago, Sciread77 said:

IF parallels were set up that would work well. I get the grouping of similar goals along with the other issues and even reclaiming the guilds. I don’t know anything about the accountabilibuddies other than it’s there. Is it set up to have challenge threads? Can our GLs create subforums for us there? Because that’d be great. 

The name comes from the idea of having accountability buddies. People would make little groups that have some kind of commonality. And then everyone would check in with the group to help people stick to their goals. You could also think of it like an adventuring party. Or a place for group challenges. It’s really pretty fluid, and up to you what you make of it.

Here are some examples from what I’ve seen in the past:

- people doing their first challenge who have meditation goals (keeping in mind that you were required to put your challenge in the newcomer subforum and there were multiple pages in that subforum)

- people with NaNoWriMo goals

- people needing a kick in the pants when they are procrastinating

- people with adulting goals

But, like I said, the core of it is a group thread where you can help keep each other accountable. In whatever way works for the people in the group.

If only a handful of people use it, I don’t see a reason to add subforums to it.

[zeroh13]

12 minutes ago, Scaly Freak said:

Mainly to stay consistent. The Warriors are a weight lifting guild, and if the general Warrior chatter thread turns into  a few pages ' worth about the importance of meditation, that'll probably cause some confusion for someone who can to the thread in the hopes of finding advise on how to pick out a lifting belt. There is of course nothing stopping that person from posting and asking about a belt in the strength training forum, or in the Warrior thread, so it's not even close to a deal breaker or a problem. Just a concern.   

To be clear, my suggestion was only meant to address the concern people have about losing the cultures that guilds have developed.

I do think seeking advice on equipment/form/routine/diet/etc is better suited to whichever Fitness and Nutrition subforum fits best. That kind of thing is why we have those subforums. And it makes it easier to see if maybe someone already asked that question before.

[Scaly Freak]

9 minutes ago, zeroh13 said:

To be clear, my suggestion was only meant to address the concern people have about losing the cultures that guilds have developed.

 

Ah, okay. And in that case the thread names don't matter very much.  

[Sciread77]

7 hours ago, zeroh13 said:

If only a handful of people use it, I don’t see a reason to add subforums to it.

I’m imagining challenges continuing in there, being refreshed. Having an “Adventurers” thread with 12,000 pages isn’t going to cut it; just looking at that will despoon virtually the whole guild on the spot, and I don’t see a reason to agree to giving up our ability to do the challenges together but separately. 
 

You can say something like we can talk in there but I don’t see us having the consistent energy to do that. We usually have a Trading Post which occasionally is awesome but doesn’t usually get as deep and is sometimes practically abandoned. The work is done in challenges in a smaller area. Part of the reason I never did Acoubtanbilibuddies (typing that out is a constant battle with my autocorrect so apologies, I give up) is that a lot of us are already Facebook friends and utilize Messenger to check in on each other and for more limited communication.  
 

I mean, we’re going to stay together as a group. I’m sure of that. I hope that the forums remain the best place for us to do that. We’ll give the new setup a try, and I’m no longer feeling panicked about it but I’m hardly a fan. 
 

The forums are a big place. Does Steve utilize the forums at all anymore?

[Heidi]

On 12/20/2020 at 3:25 PM, Teros said:

specific guild and some felt like a ghost town which made me not want to visit. 

Some guilds, like their members, are very small and quiet.

But that doesn't mean that they were inactive or without merit. Not every guild exists to be entertaining or immediately engaging in thirty seconds or less.

 

While I understand that this might seems like a "dead zone" to most, it had value to those who were inhabiting it.

[Heidi]

On 12/20/2020 at 10:30 PM, Rurik Harrgath said:

We aren't gaining members and our newbies don't stick around;

What is the purpose of the forum? How do we measure its success? I'm not being difficult or cute, I'm actually interested.

[Heidi]

On 12/20/2020 at 10:30 PM, Rurik Harrgath said:

relevant discussion subforums go unused and make the forums appear dead,

He's not dead, he's just pinin' for the fjords!

Also, mostly dead still means slightly alive.

 

[Sciread77]

7 minutes ago, Heidi said:

He's not dead, he's just pinin' for the fjords!

Also, mostly dead still means slightly alive.

 

 

11 minutes ago, Heidi said:

What is the purpose of the forum? How do we measure its success? I'm not being difficult or cute, I'm actually interested.

Especially given that the forums are part of a business and not a nonprofit, this being funded by private funds, I also would like more info on this. My understanding is that the book and maybe some of the group products are intended to bring people in, and the forum’s purpose is twofold: to keep them around and help them develop while also providing a place to promote new and existing products. 
 

https://bloggerjet.com/how-steve-kamb-turned-nerd-fitness-into-a-six-figure-business/

 

In this interview, Steve talks about having brought on an editor and not having a particular marketing strategy aside from making great content (which he excels at). The forums are kind of the secret weapon here as well. He also notes that most people probably wouldn’t buy any of his products and that’s ok as long as he’s helping people, but on the flip side it might be less ok if you’re trying to sign people’s paychecks. I mean, I’d buy merch or ebooks or new products and stuff but maybe part of the problem is it’s not as well promoted or doesn’t reach all corners of the site. I honestly don’t even know if there’s a “what’s new to buy” section here. 
 

I do think the forums have leveraged the market of ideas within its members to magnify Steve’s great content and ideas, and it has to serve as a place to catch and hold new people not just for business purposes but because he’s trying to make a difference and that requires getting people to stick with what they start. 
 

I’m sure none of this is new to GLs or anyone who has been trying to figure all this out. I do believe that there’s a way to create the necessary forum structures to keep the special thing we’ve developed as well as bring in and process new people. 
 

8 hours ago, zeroh13 said:

People would make little groups that have some kind of commonality. And then everyone would check in with the group to help people stick to their goals. You could also think of it like an adventuring party. Or a place for group challenges. It’s really pretty fluid, and up to you what you make of it.

See, I love this idea as an evolution of what we have. But the name really doesn’t communicate that very well especially since we use a lot of RPG language elsewhere. Adventuring Parties would be an excellent framework for what we currently have, especially given that many of us share a culture, situation, and/or community but don’t necessarily have the same fitness goals. If we could have 5-week challenge subforums for different Adventuring Parties that would absolutely rock. 

[Teros]

14 hours ago, Rurik Harrgath said:

Why can't it be both for some folks and not for others?

Well that's why I said in that very same post:

16 hours ago, Teros said:

I think this place is what you make of it.   +  So I don't think it's a matter of 'should' or 'shouldn't'.  Not everyone is gonna connect to bujos.  Not everyone is gonna connect to a rant where I'm talking about depression or feeling like I'm losing motivation.  We're all different. 

I never implied:

14 hours ago, Rurik Harrgath said:

slam anyone else for using checkboxes or a bullet journal instead of favoring a steam-of-thought pouring of sentiment and experiences.

If that's what people want to do: go for it.

 

In the same token, saying:

14 hours ago, Rurik Harrgath said:

we need to keep in mind this is first and foremost Nerd. Fitness. 

 

I don't want to get into specific details since this stuff was said in private, but I've had multiple people talk to me in private messages about being abused and keeping weight on as a sort of defense mechanism to prevent from being hurt.  As a person going in the therapy field, fitness would definitely be hindered by the emotional issues.  People don't stick with the fitness if they are depressed, feeling anxious, feeling helpless, feeling hopeless, and dealing with struggles with work, family, and friends.  For me (and again, I'm not slamming anyone else), the mental aspect is a bigger part of the fitness than the actual squats or paleo meal.  Mental health and physical health are integrated with each other.  I know that when I had emotional support, the fitness side finally stuck and I lost 120 pounds and beat multiple Spartan races.  Isolating physical fitness from mental health, to me, just doesn't work.  But that's my world-view and some people might think differently.  I don't need a tutorial on how to bench press: I need friends who care about me and who I care equally about.  That emotional support is when I can actually push myself with fitness.

 

14 hours ago, Rurik Harrgath said:

Shouldn't a Rebellion identity come first, a Guild affiliation second?  We're all members of the same forum after all.  Every challenge is its own mini-community too.

 

Agreed with this but I see the sentiment that was brought up in that reply.

[Sciread77]

4 minutes ago, Teros said:

I don't want to get into specific details since this stuff was said in private, but I've had multiple people talk to me in private messages about being abused and keeping weight on as a sort of defense mechanism to prevent from being hurt.  As a person going in the therapy field, fitness would definitely be hindered by the emotional issues.  People don't stick with the fitness if they are depressed, feeling anxious, feeling helpless, feeling hopeless, and dealing with struggles with work, family, and friends.  For me (and again, I'm not slamming anyone else), the mental aspect is a bigger part of the fitness than the actual squats or paleo meal.  Mental health and physical health are integrated with each other.  I know that when I had emotional support, the fitness side finally stuck and I lost 120 pounds and beat multiple Spartan races.  Isolating physical fitness from mental health, to me, just doesn't work.  But that's my world-view and some people might think differently.  I don't need a tutorial on how to bench press: I need friends who care about me and who I care equally about.  That emotional support is when I can actually push myself with fitness.

I have serious doubts that long-term physical fitness is feasible for most people without a reasonable handle on mental health part of it.  The peaks of my physical abilities were built on a house of cards and not sustainable due to the mental health and support issues that I had. It’s important to note that I had absolutely no idea each time that I was using physical training as a bandage for deeper issues, and it’s something that is pretty common.  Not everyone, to be sure. But the value of a community is helping lift one another up and supporting each other, and having something deeper can be critical for a lot of us. Especially as we get older and have families and careers and develop other physical or emotional challenges. Or go through divorce or lose loved ones. Or deal with pandemics and community collapse. 
 

For several years my weight and physical abilities were like a yo yo and a big chunk of that was lacking a community like we have here for my mental health. 

[chemgeek]

General request/question: How do I keep in touch with the folks I know well here without the forum structure? Most folks aren't tagging threads at all - so can you follow specific users? Not sure how to make sure the folks I know don't get lost in a sea of threads from folks I don't know (happy to make new connections, and also the friends I already have are important to me type of thing).

[Renate]

32 minutes ago, chemgeek said:

Most folks aren't tagging threads at all - so can you follow specific users?

 

Ah, a question I can answer!  If you click on someone's username, it'll lead you to their profile page, where you can click on "Follow Member" which is one of two buttons right next to their PF and username  

 

[Everyone brainstorming, you are doing swimmingly, thank you all for investing your time in the forum. I am following along and nodding with all points mentioned. Personally, I've just been freestyling using the forum up until now, since I wasn't sure how it was all structured and how the usage changed with time, so it's actually nice to be around for the new forum restyle to be there and read about the thought process and everything. ]

[spezzy]

1 hour ago, chemgeek said:

General request/question: How do I keep in touch with the folks I know well here without the forum structure? Most folks aren't tagging threads at all - so can you follow specific users? Not sure how to make sure the folks I know don't get lost in a sea of threads from folks I don't know (happy to make new connections, and also the friends I already have are important to me type of thing).

 

Great question - tagging was added AFTER we created the all-guild challenge this last time, and many didn't go back and tag. 

 

You can follow a specific user, by clicking on their profile, and selecting "Follow"

 

I'm working on some better instructions for these will work with the new system, including how to follow individual users, and having streams set up so you can click on a button and see all users you're following - stay tuned for those

[spezzy]

On 12/21/2020 at 9:34 AM, Sciread77 said:

Maybe another part of the issue is that I’ve used the forums for processing things and it feels a lot more personal for me than a forum should be? In any case, thank you to you all. 

 

20 hours ago, Teros said:

I totally have treated this for the majority of my time on here more like a livejournal than some some of bujo-type of thing.  I think this place is what you make of it.  And while I was in school, I sort of went into mini-posts because mentally I just couldn't write anything.  But I know that in the process, I feel like I became disconnected from here and want to reconnect the way I used to be on here.  So I don't think it's a matter of 'should' or 'shouldn't'.  Not everyone is gonna connect to bujos.  Not everyone is gonna connect to a rant where I'm talking about depression or feeling like I'm losing motivation.  We're all different.  I personally want to be more open, honest, and 'raw' with what I'm talking about, as me doing that allows others to also let their guard down and be equally raw.  And doing that helps me feel a real connection and stay motivated to be on here.  Knowing someone did their lifts for the day?  Ehh, that's nice but that's not my style so I need to kick myself in the ass to post on here more overall. 😛 

 

3 hours ago, Teros said:

I don't want to get into specific details since this stuff was said in private, but I've had multiple people talk to me in private messages about being abused and keeping weight on as a sort of defense mechanism to prevent from being hurt.  As a person going in the therapy field, fitness would definitely be hindered by the emotional issues.  People don't stick with the fitness if they are depressed, feeling anxious, feeling helpless, feeling hopeless, and dealing with struggles with work, family, and friends.  For me (and again, I'm not slamming anyone else), the mental aspect is a bigger part of the fitness than the actual squats or paleo meal.  Mental health and physical health are integrated with each other.  I know that when I had emotional support, the fitness side finally stuck and I lost 120 pounds and beat multiple Spartan races.  Isolating physical fitness from mental health, to me, just doesn't work.  But that's my world-view and some people might think differently.  I don't need a tutorial on how to bench press: I need friends who care about me and who I care equally about.  That emotional support is when I can actually push myself with fitness.

 

3 hours ago, Sciread77 said:

I have serious doubts that long-term physical fitness is feasible for most people without a reasonable handle on mental health part of it.  The peaks of my physical abilities were built on a house of cards and not sustainable due to the mental health and support issues that I had. It’s important to note that I had absolutely no idea each time that I was using physical training as a bandage for deeper issues, and it’s something that is pretty common.  Not everyone, to be sure. But the value of a community is helping lift one another up and supporting each other, and having something deeper can be critical for a lot of us. Especially as we get older and have families and careers and develop other physical or emotional challenges. Or go through divorce or lose loved ones. Or deal with pandemics and community collapse. 
 

For several years my weight and physical abilities were like a yo yo and a big chunk of that was lacking a community like we have here for my mental health. 

 

Mental health is an extremely important part of fitness - and that's a core belief and pillar of NerdFitness. All areas of NF use three big categories - nutrition, workouts, and mindset. They ALL work together. 

 

You can use these forums however you want - as a livejournal, as a bujo, it doesn't matter. It's what works best for YOU at that time. I know personally, I've had periods of my life where I've poured my soul into my thread, and I've had periods of my life where I need to process things alone, and times when all I could keep up with was checkboxes. ALL formats are great. It's all up to what you personally need at the time to help you progress. 

 

 If using your thread as a way to process things is helpful for you - please do it.  If you want to have a list of checkboxes - please do that.  There is no "should be".  

 

 

 

[spezzy]

Hey all - I'm going to close this thread for now. 

 

To be clear, I'm not trying to silence anyone, and if I haven't replied to something yet, it's not that I'm not listening, or don't want to reply, or won't come back to it  

 

But right now, what we need to do is focus. We can talk about these things all day for weeks - but I think it's time to start focusing on making the changes we've already agreed will make an impact (like the home page, updated streams / stream locations / etc), and then come back to this discussion after we've seen how these all work and what they look like and have had a chance to try it out. 

 

So I'm going to work on creating those, as well as play around with the forum technology to see what else I can do with it, and what I can make work within the forum system so that we can have it ready for zero week after the holiday. 

 

Once we have that, I think we'll have a clearer vision of what we have, and how we can tweak it to make it better. 

 

In that time - I encourage you to still think about ideas. What would make these forums the most awesome for you, inside or outside of the challenge environment?  How can we make them better? How can we better support you? How can we better support each other? 

 

Happy Holidays  

 

 

 

 

[Heidi]

Where should we submit bug reports and feature issues?

[Tanktimus the Encourager]

52 minutes ago, Heidi said:

Where should we submit bug reports and feature issues?

Spezzy set up this thread: