Help me understand this quote...

[skip-tracer]

Someone just said "If you don't like yourself how can you expect anyone else to like you?".

It struck me that I really have no idea what this means, despite this being quite a commonly expressed idea. Why is someone's opinion of themselves (or self esteem or self confidence, or whatever) such an issue to someone else when it comes to relationships?

Is it simply a dis-likable character trait to not be in love with yourself? Or is it something deeper than that? Some sort of Darwinian concept to keep the sad-sacks out of the gene pool? Do you really need to be content with your life to be loved?

Could it be that someone's unhappiness with themselves would be taken to suggest that they are seeking relationships with others in order to "complete" themselves which is somehow futile? (I'm sure there's a better way to express that).

I'm asking mostly just because I'm curious to understand the saying, but it does have some basis in my life. People have said something similar to this quote to me on several occasions and although I could be accused of having a bit of a negative outlook on life I thought I was mostly just making jokes at my expense, I didn't think it was quite so harmful to have low self esteem. I was just trying to come across like Woody Allen or something.

Any thoughts on this? I find my lack of understanding of the phrase to be quite confusing.

Man, I wish I could afford a therapist.

[ETFnerd]

people like to be around positive people... i remember when i wasn't so positive so i try to be empathetic toward people who aren't... many people will write off those who aren't positive... just like they would those who are overweight, unattractive, etc... it's just a fact of life...

all other things being equal... which do you enjoy more...? talking with people with fresh breath or those with bad breath...?

[unicornassassin]

Could it be that someone's unhappiness with themselves would be taken to suggest that they are seeking relationships with others in order to "complete" themselves which is somehow futile? (I'm sure there's a better way to express that).

... I didn't think it was quite so harmful to have low self esteem.

Yes, in my own experience (yet again we are similiar!) when I try to find someone to love me, in order to prove to myself that I am loveable- disaster strikes. I become very codependent and controlling, miserable, and I make my partner miserable.

I've learned that low self-esteem is incredibly harmful for me, and it's pretty much the root of all my problems.

As far as Woody Allen, even though he's very self-deprecating, I would guess he actually has pretty good self-esteem, otherwise he probably wouldn't be where he is. I know when I joke about myself in a loving way, people laugh with me. When I rip on myself in a mean way, people get very uncomfortable and weirded out.

[AustralMoonBear]

I've always taken it (like a lot of sayings) as an over simplification of a realy complex thing but in my mind it boils down as follows.

If you don't like/love yourself you tend to not show the world your best. You criticise yourself publicly, won't try new things because "you know you'll just fail" won't talk to new people etc. If you can't put yourslef in new situations you don't meet new people (no opportunity for people to like/love you) if you do meet people you don't show them what there is to like/love about you.

Of course some people can/will still like/love you if you don't love yourself but the vast majority of new relationships will struggle to start.

Like I said, an oversimplification but that's how I've always taken it. Hope that made sense.

[engineman312]

if you can't love your self, if you can't embrace your faults as much as you embrace your good qualities, how can you expect anyone else to?

[leadchipmunk]

While it isn't a completely true statement, I believe it does have some merit. I've always understood it as in a long-term relationship (romantic/friendly/professional/etc.) people will generally be put off by someone with low self-esteem. It doesn't always happen (I know I have loved many people with low self-esteem) but it is likely. And if someone does like you, it can be a motivating factor to better your self-esteem.

Could it be that someone's unhappiness with themselves would be taken to suggest that they are seeking relationships with others in order to "complete" themselves which is somehow futile? (I'm sure there's a better way to express that).

That makes perfect sense to me. I have done that, as have many people, sought a relationship that fulfilled the part of me that I thought was missing but it always ended.

[Perdi]

I had a friend who spent all her time talking about how her life was terrible and she hated herself. All she would talk about was herself; her self-loathing made her self-centered. At one point, I had a cancer scare. Had to have a biopsy. It was a terrifying time. I told her I was going to get a biopsy to see if I had cancer, and she focused on that for all of about two seconds before resuming her speech about how terrible her life was and how awful she felt and how all her friends always leave her. All her friends leave her because she's a negative black hole of neediness. She had no self esteem of her own. Her self worth was determined by other people's opinions of her. She was always assuming her friends hated her. Always asking "you guys like me, right?" She said she hated herself. Constantly. No one I know who knew her is friends with her anymore. She was exhausting to be around, a total emotional vampire. Spending time with her made you depressed and drained. So yeah, tl;dr version: Self-loathing is not a likeable trait.

[Luthorcrow]

Sorry but it is truism. It is true for a few reasons.

1. If you do not have a base what do you have to build upon? It is like trying to build a home on top of a sink hole.
   
2. It is similar to orgasms. If you do not already know how to pleasure yourself, how could you possible tell someone else how to pleasure you?
   
3. Self-loathing is a self-centered and a state that tends to self-perpetuate. It would be hard from someone self-focused to be able to give deeply.
   

[concretecavewoman]

If you don't like/love yourself you tend to not show the world your best. You criticise yourself publicly, won't try new things because "you know you'll just fail" won't talk to new people etc. If you can't put yourslef in new situations you don't meet new people (no opportunity for people to like/love you) if you do meet people you don't show them what there is to like/love about you.

Of course some people can/will still like/love you if you don't love yourself but the vast majority of new relationships will struggle to start.

This. Also, think of 'like' as 'respect'. The way you treat yourself is a model for how others ought to treat you, and sets expectations for the kind of treatment that you expect or allow.

There is a variant of this trope: "you can't love someone else until you love yourself." I think that's equally true.

[CowboyMisterIndependent]

I had a friend who spent all her time talking about how her life was terrible and she hated herself. All she would talk about was herself; her self-loathing made her self-centered.

^This. Self-loathing is incredibly vain and self-centered. It has just as much to do with pride as narcissism does, because the world still revolves around people who can't stop talking about how terrible their lives are.

ADDITIONALLY.

If a person doesn't live his or herself, they tend to doubt the love of others when it's given. It's difficult for them to understand why another person would love them (since they don't love themselves), so they being to doubt others' true feelings or suspect them of ulterior motives or dishonesty. A very unfortunate circumstance.

NOW.

Just because you have to love yourself doesn't mean that you have to be perfectly content with everything going on in your life and your current circumstances. It just means that you know your own worth- which is impossible to measure, it's so huge.

I look at it this way: EVERYONE has the potential to be an amazing, incredible, absolutely invaluable human being. That amazing, incredible, invaluable person is inside every one of us like David in the marble just waiting to be carved out (usually through difficult, painful, stressful life experiences and personal growth).

If I know that every person I meet, hang out with, and develop a relationship with has that sort of infinite potential to become whatever and whoever they want...well, it's hard not to love them!

So a person just has to always remember that they are a rock star, and they're a great part of the life of every person they're going to meet just waiting to happen.

Short version: I love you all because you're all rock stars and you even get BONUS points for being part of a community of people seeking to improve and become better. What's not to love?!

[rix]

I also agree with Perdy and CowboyMisterIndependent.

I have phases (I try to minimize them) when I think I am just plain ugly, and anti-social, and ... you get the drill. My boyfriend gets totally uncomfortable when I am like this and I can understand this. People who are depressed about themselves due to their low self-esteem can provoke and undistinctive feeling of aggression or revulsion. It is basically a passive-aggressive attitude.

I know that I have to fight with myself to stand by one of my friend's side - every time she thinks about herself and her life she gets depressed and tells me how bad she feels and how she can't change anything about her misery. ("I'm so fat, and I still live with my mother and I hate it here, and she always wants to know everything in my life and it is so annoying. My life is horrible.")

It is just really easier to help people if the acknowledge and accept their weaknesses and look for ways to overcome them, IMHO. ("I think I am overweight and I really want to move to an own flat - I heard about this diet / Do you know any diet that could help me?")

But if they are feeling helpless and show no motivation at all to get out of their situation, I always come close to yelling at them to get their act together and do something (I wouldn't yell at them, ever! It's just how I feel).

[Mordechaj]

[Zorch]

people like to be around positive people... i remember when i wasn't so positive so i try to be empathetic toward people who aren't... many people will write off those who aren't positive... just like they would those who are overweight, unattractive, etc... it's just a fact of life...

all other things being equal... which do you enjoy more...? talking with people with fresh breath or those with bad breath...?

But I think there's more to it than that. When a group of people that have never met before convenes(think meetings at work), the social ordering will sort itself out - it's something that can sometimes be subtle, even unconscious - certain people will take on a more dominant role, and others will be pushed(mostly) to the side. Generally, one's self-perception, whether one is aware of it or not, plays a big role in how one behaves in such situations, and the role one falls into.

It's not just how you talk about yourself, or whether you project pessimism vs. optimism - it's much more subtle than that. And the subtleties associated with "liking yourself" - or perhaps self-belief, go a long way towards projecting a more magnetic, attractive image in many environments.

[Georges]

"If you don't like yourself how can you expect anyone else to like you?"

On almost a side thought:

"to like" in that quote is an action-y verb, not a describe-y verb. (Can a grammar nerd help me out here?)

Consider the difference between someone who is unhappy with herself and is in the process of leveling up, versus someone who is unhappy with herself and is doing nothing to change. The first example likes/values/respects herself, even if she dislikes something about herself. There is some kind of important distinction here, but I haven't teased the thought all the way through to a conclusion yet.

[leadchipmunk]

Mordechaj, I love you. Shel Silverstein is awesome, and his stories tend to go quite deep. More than just stories for kids. Good call on that.

I remember reading that book in front of class my 10th grade French class. Fun times.

[ETFnerd]

But I think there's more to it than that.

true dat... life is richer than the volumes that people write about it... that's why you have to live life, not solely read about it in a library... or in an online forum...

[yoovie]

I've always seen it as... if you teach someone to see you as less than your worth- either directly orby saying so (im worthless, etc) or by the way you treat yourself (as less important than they are or what they want, as not deserving of a good body, of happiness, of what you really truly want, of quiet time, of personal ambition, etc) , eventually it will sink into their brains, as the truth about you.

That truth being that you aren't as important as them or their needs, and you'll have beaten yourself down so far that when you finally realise that its time for you to stand up and say No More, they are going to laugh.

Think of it more along the lines of, you cant expect anyone else to respect you, if you don't respect yourself. Its a much better way to state it- someone just made it all love and like cause it would appeal more to chicks that way.

[Luthorcrow]

@CowboyMisterIndependent - You said it with a lot more eloquence then I did, and I completely agree with your post.

[skip-tracer]

Thanks for all the replies, it makes more sense to me now. I always just thought it was one of those phrases that had no real meaning but I can see where the person who said it was coming from now.

The idea that self-loathing is as self-centred as narcissism is interesting.

In my case I think this became a problem because I was playing down my good qualities as a way to appear humble and lower people's expectations of me. But somewhere along the line the "act" somehow became how I actually viewed myself. Like lots of similar issues it feels like a difficult cycle to break. Also, to be honest, I do have a bit of a natural inclination towards whining which doesn't help.

[Anna]

ADDITIONALLY.

If a person doesn't love his or herself, they tend to doubt the love of others when it's given. It's difficult for them to understand why another person would love them (since they don't love themselves), so they being to doubt others' true feelings or suspect them of ulterior motives or dishonesty. A very unfortunate circumstance.

^This this this!!

In my lowest moments I have a hard time believing people when they say they love me. I internalize the question: "Why? Why do you love me? It doesn't make any sense"

Self-loathing also definitely leads to suspecting other people of being dishonest or hiding something from you (cause they can't possibly ACTUALLY love you, you rationalize). I cannot begin to express how often I have had to fight myself to stay out of my friend's or boyfriend's business and not be insanely jealous. I believe that no matter your relationship, everyone deserves some privacy. I flatter myself that I do a pretty good job of keeping my nose out of places it isn't invited (even if it really wants to be there).

As for the quote, I think it has a lot of truth in it. It's very important to learn to like yourself. Not necessarily in the "OMG I'M SO AMAZINGG I WANT TO HAVE MY BABIES" sort of way. (Although I hope you want your own babies. Maybe that's not such a good example) I think acceptance of who you are is more important than being in love with yourself. If you accept who you are, with time you will grow to like yourself. People will notice.

If you like yourself despite this fault or that fault, how much more likely are you to accept them despite theirs?

I myself have come a long way on the road to self-acceptance, and my relationships have been much brighter since.