Question about fat

[LordOfTime]

We know that excess carbs are converted to body fat, but what does the body do with excess dietary fat? Does it just eliminate it or does it get stored somewhere?

[realbrickwall]

According to the internet, the fat is broken down as if for conversion into energy, then re-assembled into fat for storage. This is because the storage mechanism of the body can't take the bulk of fat cells.

I am not a real scientist. I just use the internet.

[ponita]

Fat is converted to energy, as are carbs, but by a different process. Both get converted to ATP, the energy currency of the body. Excessive energy, be it from carbs or fat, will eventually be converted to body fat. However, more ATP is used converting dietary fat to energy than converting carbs to energy.

Basically, your body has to work harder to convert dietary fat to energy, while converting carbs to energy is really simple and more likely to lead in excessive energy which will then be stored as body fat.

Someone who has taken biochem more recently than myself (has it really been 5 years???) will be able to recall the details better....

[Waldo]

We know that excess carbs are converted to body fat

LOL.

If there is one thing metabolically that specifically never happens at a relevant level, it is the conversion of carbs to fat, this is pretty well proven in the world of science.

A few writers that champion low carb diets (here's lookin at you Gary Taubes) have created a commentary and have managed to convince the vast majority of people of something that flat out isn't backed by science in the least bit.

[Barmacral]

Actually Waldo, do you have any links handy about that? I'd love to read more on it.

[Waldo]

http://www.ajcn.org/content/61/4/952S.full.pdf

[notanartmajor]

Body fat is excess energy incarnate, regardless of what you're eating to get that excess.

[LordOfTime]

Nevermind

[LinkOfHyrule]

Wait so what happens to excess carbs then Waldo?

[Luthorcrow]

Waldo never eats excess carbs.

Fat does a lot more burn for energy. It insulates your organs, keeps your skin healthy, helps absorb fat soluble vitamins and of course some fats are essential. I could be crazy but I do not think there any essential carbs other than you need some for energy.

[Waldo]

Wait so what happens to excess carbs then Waldo?

It is stored as glycogen.

The body is always burning both glycogen and fat. The relative quantities of each it is burning is determined by how much glycogen you have at the moment.

The whole anti-fat fad came about specifically because science showed that only dietary fat is stored as body fat. That isn't just a load of crap. But it is an incomplete picture. Every bit as incomplete as the picture that the carb haters push. The individual components cannot be separated from the diet as a whole. Both are too caught up in the mechanism, looking at the trees in detail, whilst missing the forest they are in.

[Razor]

It is stored as glycogen.

The body is always burning both glycogen and fat. The relative quantities of each it is burning is determined by how much glycogen you have at the moment.

The whole anti-fat fad came about specifically because science showed that only dietary fat is stored as body fat. That isn't just a load of crap. But it is an incomplete picture. Every bit as incomplete as the picture that the carb haters push. The individual components cannot be separated from the diet as a whole. Both are too caught up in the mechanism, looking at the trees in detail, whilst missing the forest they are in.

So are you saying then that keto doesn't work? A lot of people are praising it as a cutting diet, saying it works great. Others say it makes them sick and they can't handle it, but it still seems to work.

Also, what happens to excess protein then? Excrement? I thought basically EVERYTHING you consumed was turned into fat if you didn't use it. I.E. all the calories you consume that aren't used are stored, and what your body can't process moves to the colon.

[Zorch]

So are you saying then that keto doesn't work? A lot of people are praising it as a cutting diet, saying it works great. Others say it makes them sick and they can't handle it, but it still seems to work.

You can lose *OR* gain weight on super-low-carb diets, depending on how much you're eating. Generally speaking denser carb sources(sugars, refined starches) contain a ton of calories and are easy to overconsume - eliminating these from the diet makes it much harder to gain/easier to lose weight for most people, which is one reason that keto diets (or even non-keto paleo) help some people achieve weight loss. Some people may also enjoy the protein/fat-heavy diet more, or some may find that it helps with issues such as blood sugar control - so there may be other reasons that it is a good choice for some people, though these reasons may be different from what some low-carb evangelists claim.

Also, what happens to excess protein then? Excrement? I thought basically EVERYTHING you consumed was turned into fat if you didn't use it. I.E. all the calories you consume that aren't used are stored, and what your body can't process moves to the colon.

Excess protein gets turned into carbohydrate(glucose/glycogen) in the body, or is sometimes excreted in the urine. Theoretically carbs can be turned into fat if your glycogen reserves are topped off, though this would require sustained consumption of a high-calorie, very carb-heavy diet(excess fructose in the liver may get converted a bit more easily than glucose/starches). What happens more typically is the scenario Waldo described - building up your glycogen reserves temporarily shifts metabolism toward burning carbs instead of fat, and whatever fat you've consumed gets stored.

If one considers the practicalities of weight gain/loss, what is really most important is a protocol that maximizes gaining/preserving of lean mass. Converting as much extra dietary protein as possible to muscle mass(or conversely, burning as little protein as possible when on a deficit) is the key to achieving a meaningful improvement in body composition over the long-term. Whether this differs meaningfully on higher-carb versus higher-fat diets is something I haven't done enough research on to offer useful commentary.

Note: The above primarily applies to the short to mid-term, and to people who have normal/near-normal metabolisms. Things are likely a bit different for folks with advanced insulin resistance/diabetes, and I think broadly speaking, the long-term impacts of specific dietary regimens(a few years to a decade or more) are not as well-quantified as the short to medium term(a few weeks to a couple years).

[Loren Wade]

LOL.

If there is one thing metabolically that specifically never happens at a relevant level, it is the conversion of carbs to fat, this is pretty well proven in the world of science.

A few writers that champion low carb diets (here's lookin at you Gary Taubes) have created a commentary and have managed to convince the vast majority of people of something that flat out isn't backed by science in the least bit.

I think it's pretty rude to LOL at someone's honest question dude. We need to be welcoming to people, not laugh in their face. It's pretty obvious by their response that they're already turned off from this thread. I don't think that's right.

Come on, man.

[Maleficarum]

http://www.ajcn.org/content/61/4/952S.full.pdf

this was an excellent read and it put some more science behind what I already knew. But, i have to make the observation that this does not accurately portray the typical American eater. Excess consumption of both carbohydrates and fat with limited physical exercise... is a very different state than an active individual who eats appropriately for their activity level. I have been fat most of my life, but i have also been very active. I know that my entire metabolism was/is potentially off balance. My consumption of food greatly exceeded the necessary energy requirements of my body. The only thing that has ever made a significant difference in my weight is monitoring my carbohydrate intake. I am currently struggling with finding the appropriate balance. I was not eating enough carbs and my body threw itself into a crazy Anxiety attack/Starvation mode... while i had huge spikes of energy and adrenaline. this is a normal biological response... but it still scared me. I believe there needs to be more long term studies done on obesity, metabolic changes and weight loss. These 1-2 month studies where participants lose 20 lbs do not suffice to explain how many changes are going on in the bodies of people who drop 50-100 lbs over a period of 6 months to a year.

[Philociraptor]

I have to make the observation that this does not accurately portray the typical American eater. Excess consumption of both carbohydrates and fat with limited physical exercise... is a very different state than an active individual who eats appropriately for their activity level.

This, 1000x. This is the reason obesity is a problem. Hyperpalatability of foods full of both carbs and fat lead to excess consumption. Topped-of glycogen stores due to low activity and excess carbs lead to no meaningful oxidation of fat and storage of dietary fat. Rinse and repeat.