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Weight loss obsession


jabbajac

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Hi everyone!

I have somewhat of a problem on my hands. Here's a little background, ever since I found NF and MDA I've been getting on the healthy train building muscle, getting stronger and overall getting healthier. My significant other also jumped on with me and we've both accomplished a lot. She's got a completely new wardrobe that is many sizes smaller (clothing size, not wardrobe size) and she's really happy about that. Unfortunately lately she's gotten really obsessive about getting on the scale and freaking out if it even budges up a little bit. It's gotten to the point where she's weighing herself at every opportunity she gets and starting to move on a really unhealthy trend. I actually fear that she may start becoming anorexic if I don't intervene and a more drastic way. I'm positive she's eating less than 1500 calories a day and now she's constantly tired and grouchy as well. I've tried explaining paleo but she refuses to believe that any fat could be good fat. I don't know how to help her out. Does anyone have any suggestions?

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Scales are against the NF creedo. Use the way your cloths fit as your measuring stick. If you guys are NFers, I'm sure you've read plenty about it, you just have to make the jump to living it.

As far as fat goes in the diet, go back to one of those books that Steve recently posted in the fantastic book post and read one of the diet ones with her. Every one of them talks about how fat doesn't make us fat and the real enemy is fast burning carbs and blood sugar spikes. If she's tired, she's probably under eating and/or going through blood sugar crashes.

Massrandir, Barkûn, Swolórin, The Whey Pilgrim
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"No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. What a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. " ~ Socrates
"Friends don't let friends squat high." ~ Chad Wesley Smith
"It's a dangerous business, Brodo, squatting to the floor. You step into the rack, and if you don't keep your form, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to." ~ Gainsdalf

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Scales are against the NF creedo.

LOLWUT

People who don't understand what it is telling them really should not be using a scale and really need to educate themselves on the various factors that influence weight.

But it is THE most valuable tool for measuring the effectiveness of one's diet, whether the goal is gaining, maintaining, or losing. Any suggestion otherwise is just silly.

currently maintaning

battle log challenges: 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1
follow me: myfitnesspal
don't panic!

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LOLWUT

People who don't understand what it is telling them really should not be using a scale and really need to educate themselves on the various factors that influence weight.

But it is THE most valuable tool for measuring the effectiveness of one's diet, whether the goal is gaining, maintaining, or losing. Any suggestion otherwise is just silly.

It doesn't tell you what you are gaining, maintaining, or losing. Measurements are THE most valuable tool. Not going more into it than that.

Massrandir, Barkûn, Swolórin, The Whey Pilgrim
500 / 330 / 625
Challenges: 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 31 32 34 35 36 39 41 42 45 46 47 48 49 Current Challenge
"No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. What a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. " ~ Socrates
"Friends don't let friends squat high." ~ Chad Wesley Smith
"It's a dangerous business, Brodo, squatting to the floor. You step into the rack, and if you don't keep your form, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to." ~ Gainsdalf

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It doesn't tell you what you are gaining, maintaining, or losing. Measurements are THE most valuable tool. Not going more into it than that.

Measurements cannot tell you if you are in a calorie deficit, balance, or surplus, or tell you the magnitude of it.

Are you losing 2 lb/wk? You've got a 1000 cal/day defict on average.

Yes measurements can give you an idea of the composition of changes, and I agree they are very important, but not as important as the scale.

Likewise if you spend time researching what people that are successful at losing weight and keeping it off do, regularly weighing themselves is one of the most common themes. Losing weight is the easy part, the vast majority of people fail at maintaining once its gone.

currently maintaning

battle log challenges: 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1
follow me: myfitnesspal
don't panic!

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Hey Corey could you post a link to this credo?

Sent from my LG-VM670 using Tapatalk 2

It's not in the rules or anything like that, but Steve is constantly addressing measuring in addition to/over weighing in his articles. In the most recent one he applauded the girl for only weighing once a month.

Personally, I weigh in once a week, if I remember to, but don't really care if I miss it. My major measurement is belt holes.

In my experience a scale is most useful when monitoring weight loss when you're in a more drastic weight loss stage, but once you've gotten to a point where you're only losing 1-2 lb between weigh ins or adding muscle at the same time, it doesn't really help. Even during the larger losses stage I found measurements and belt hole changes to be much more satisfying. Even changes in how certain belt holes felt, such as tight when first switched and moving from there through comfortable and eventually to loose, are more satisying to me than what the scale says.

Massrandir, Barkûn, Swolórin, The Whey Pilgrim
500 / 330 / 625
Challenges: 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 31 32 34 35 36 39 41 42 45 46 47 48 49 Current Challenge
"No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. What a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. " ~ Socrates
"Friends don't let friends squat high." ~ Chad Wesley Smith
"It's a dangerous business, Brodo, squatting to the floor. You step into the rack, and if you don't keep your form, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to." ~ Gainsdalf

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I know all of these things and I follow the NF approach to many of these. I'm proud of my accomplishments, I've slimmed down a few sizes already and I'm keeping track of my progress with what I can fit in and how I look in the mirror. My gf unfortunately is hell bent on stepping on the scale and tracking that. She'll weigh herself, eat something then weigh herself again. It's gotten to the point that it's obsessive and destructive. I'm trying to figure out a way to get her off of stepping on the scale obsessively and obsess over her weight. I've talked to her about it before and her mindset is something that is completely opposite of what NF is about, which is she doesn't care what she looks like as long as the number on the scale doesn't go up. I really wanna help her but I know I won't be able to just take away the scale and have that fix the problem. She's already lost a ton of weight and is seriously approaching extremely thin. Anyone used to obsess over scale number but finally changed? How did you do it? Thanks!

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In my experience a scale is most useful when monitoring weight loss when you're in a more drastic weight loss stage, but once you've gotten to a point where you're only losing 1-2 lb between weigh ins or adding muscle at the same time, it doesn't really help.

I would argue that the scale is most important when gaining muscle. Go too fast and you are gaining mostly fat, too small and your body can adapt to the surplus metabolically without any storage to either fat or muscle. There is a very small band, a 200-500 cal/day suplus (or so), where your bulking efforts will be most effective.

What makes this more difficult is that your body both adapts to the surplus (same as it adapts to a deficit) slowly, and as you gain muscle mass your metabolism increases, thus that very small band is actually a moving target ever increasing upward.

Gaining muscle mass while losing fat is a borderline irrelevant process, almost every bit of weight gain is actually related to the glycogen or C-P system and will be peed away in a week or two if you quit strength training, and not real muscle mass (unless you are doing hardcore macro cycling, with the number of variables involved the scale is going to be critical to the process as well).

currently maintaning

battle log challenges: 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1
follow me: myfitnesspal
don't panic!

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I know all of these things and I follow the NF approach to many of these. I'm proud of my accomplishments, I've slimmed down a few sizes already and I'm keeping track of my progress with what I can fit in and how I look in the mirror. My gf unfortunately is hell bent on stepping on the scale and tracking that. She'll weigh herself, eat something then weigh herself again. It's gotten to the point that it's obsessive and destructive. I'm trying to figure out a way to get her off of stepping on the scale obsessively and obsess over her weight. I've talked to her about it before and her mindset is something that is completely opposite of what NF is about, which is she doesn't care what she looks like as long as the number on the scale doesn't go up. I really wanna help her but I know I won't be able to just take away the scale and have that fix the problem. She's already lost a ton of weight and is seriously approaching extremely thin. Anyone used to obsess over scale number but finally changed? How did you do it? Thanks!

Anybody that frequently steps on the scale MUST write it down. Graphing it is even better.

For example here's the last graph I pulled from my spreadsheet:

Weightwt712.jpg

It is much, much easier to get a good idea of what is going on when you see things visually, and it really helps to put the numbers in perspective, where the trend is more important than the individual datapoint.

I've weighed myself 2 times a day from day 1 (9/11/11) and still do today (despite reaching my loss goals last spring). I have no intention of stopping.

For me even more important than the trend is extracting my metabolism to really get a guage of how things are going.

currently maintaning

battle log challenges: 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1
follow me: myfitnesspal
don't panic!

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Okay well, I agree with your long form a bit more, Corey.

I weigh myself every single morning. I use a "Hacker's Diet" style trending average, which smooths out the rough spots.

I pay attention to measurement to be sure, but I'm content if i maintain weight while getting stronger.

GrimmThing - Warrior

Maybe I'm just too dumb to collapse - - too ugly to die !! I'll let you figure out the reasons...

Current ChallengeNF Workout Log

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I like how this thread isn't even about how to help someone stop descending into an eating disorder and is really an argument about what tool is better for seeing how you're doing. The real thing to focus on here is to get this person to stop freaking out when the scale goes up by any ounce.

Of course she will weigh more after she eats; there is food actively inside of her weighing her down. She will deceptively seem heavier when she drinks, when she has some sodium, when she eats and when she doesn't use the restroom for some period of time. That goes away when she uses the restroom and disposes of waste and even overnight as the body keeps digesting what's in there. The scale will even go up if she loses body fat but gains some muscle, and she will still achieve the same thing she wants to accomplish without hurting herself in the end. I know you get that based on your posts. If she doesn't understand this bit, that what makes people fat is simple grain and not fat storing itself into the body, then I think the only thing that will help is figuring out a way to educate her on the subject. You learned the right way, so I'm willing to bet that if she sat down and actually read the same things, read the same success stories, that some of that information might stick.

If she is unwilling to sit down and actually educate herself on her own, take the direct adult approach about it. Just be honest and tell her you're concerned where she's headed and that you're both in this lifestyle together, so you want to make sure she's taking care of herself in a way that isn't going to negatively affect her life. Ask how happy she is with life having to check the scale every hour on the hour or if she'd be happier eating chicken and eggs or what have you whenever she was hungry without having to worry whether she was eating too much. I don't know what to degree you've done this already, but I think just the honest approach and telling her you're worried about what she's doing should be enough to at least get her to stop and listen and consider that much if nothing else.

Sorry if this is a bit of a nonsensical ramble, I'm not fully there right now.

Profession: Level 3 Sith Assassin, Slingshot Demon Slayer (Rank: Spy)Stats: STR 6 DEX 5.25 CON 9 STA 2 WIS 6.5 CHA 1Motto: Do you really want it? Luchar por ella.Links: Six Week Challenge | Life GoalsQOTD: HA! "Your Honor, permission to Kong Vault over the bench?" -- AtSeaLevel

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@spencer : Thanks for your reply, you were right on the money. English and communications is not really a strong suite of mine but overall yes, I'm trying to prevent her from developing an eating disorder. I know what the good ways of measurement are and I know what I should be doing and I do what I'm supposed to be doing. Sadly she's very hell bent on what she things and won't even listen to what I have to say no matter how unhappy it makes her and how obsessive it makes her. I'll try sitting her down and seriously talking to her about it but I may need more drastic action.

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If she doesn't understand this bit, that what makes people fat is simple grain and not fat storing itself into the body and not, then I think the only thing that will help is figuring out a way to educate her on the subject.

But this is, for the most part, complete hogwash.

Almost all the fat you eat is stored as fat. Your body is always burning both fat and carbs. The rate of fat burn is set by the levels of glycogen in the body (stored carbs). If that rate exceeds the rate of intake, your fat mass decreases. If that rate is less than the rate of intake, your fat mass increases. The whole "carbs are stored as fat" thing is utter crap, de novo lipogenesis (its scientific name) is an irrelevant process in the human body. This is basic human metabolism 101 and readily accessed in scientific literature, not whatever the latest diet fadsters are trying to sell you.

Low fat diets work and are very viable.

The OP's post doesn't really indicate any specifics. What are her goals? Does he even know. I mean, if she's near her goal and really focused on it and not severely undereating (without a lot of exercise, under 1500 calories is perfectly viable for a female), her behavior could be perfectly normal. If you are trying to push Paleo on someone that has had success other ways (which seems to be the case), expect serious pushback.

I mean, my wife thought I was an overobsessive freak when it came to losing weight, and I'd laugh at her if she tried to convert me to Paleo. If she kept pushing it on me about it I'm sure I'd sound like a grouchy jerk too. Being regularly talked to about my food choices when they are clearly working for me would really tick me off.

currently maintaning

battle log challenges: 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1
follow me: myfitnesspal
don't panic!

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I'm not a fad dieter, so I wouldn't really know what they're trying to sell. What I do know is that while counting calories is an effective method, I've lost body fat just by getting rid of simple carbs, which was my point.

Profession: Level 3 Sith Assassin, Slingshot Demon Slayer (Rank: Spy)Stats: STR 6 DEX 5.25 CON 9 STA 2 WIS 6.5 CHA 1Motto: Do you really want it? Luchar por ella.Links: Six Week Challenge | Life GoalsQOTD: HA! "Your Honor, permission to Kong Vault over the bench?" -- AtSeaLevel

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I know all of these things and I follow the NF approach to many of these. I'm proud of my accomplishments, I've slimmed down a few sizes already and I'm keeping track of my progress with what I can fit in and how I look in the mirror. My gf unfortunately is hell bent on stepping on the scale and tracking that. She'll weigh herself, eat something then weigh herself again. It's gotten to the point that it's obsessive and destructive. I'm trying to figure out a way to get her off of stepping on the scale obsessively and obsess over her weight. I've talked to her about it before and her mindset is something that is completely opposite of what NF is about, which is she doesn't care what she looks like as long as the number on the scale doesn't go up. I really wanna help her but I know I won't be able to just take away the scale and have that fix the problem. She's already lost a ton of weight and is seriously approaching extremely thin. Anyone used to obsess over scale number but finally changed? How did you do it? Thanks!

Hey, dude; recovering anorexic here. If you love her, and you think she is developing a serious problem, you have to help her. Unfortunately, know that if she is anorexic (here are some common warning signs ), you might lose her in the process, because if she has made the decent into obsession... intervening isn't going to be pretty. It's just as bad as breaking a drug or alcohol addiction, and she will fight you every step of the way. It really is best to seek professional help. Know that if she is anorexic, the only way she will get help is if she realizes she is sick and decides she *wants* to get help. There is nothing you can do to force it on her, but make your concern known.

It sounds like this has just started, so... if she is reading fitness blogs at all, point her toward this great post about metabolic damage, it does a good job of explaining the damage eating nothing does, without sounding accusatory. If she's just really conscious of her health and is just misguided, it could go a long way to discourage the calorie restriction habit. That blogger is also really great at talking about body image issues, etc in a good way and not in a... way that encourages a negative mindset (I won't name names, but... there is a ton of pro-ana stuff out there that is very subtle in it's promotion).

Really, if she is going down the path of anorexia, the only way she's going to get better is if she talks to a professional. It's an illness, it can't be fixed by well-meaning friends. I can tell you now, I never sought help for anorexia, because it was my "best friend." The fact that I came by help for my disorder was purely by coincidence (I went through a very traumatic experience and got stuck in crisis counselling, and there we worked on a whole slew of issues beyond my PTSD, including my negative body image and self-destructive eating habits). I was sick for 7 years and no one in my life ever spoke up; I honestly don't know if I would have sought help if they had, but... saying something now and maybe getting through to her has got to be better than watching her slowing kill herself and knowing you did nothing.

I really hope this turns out okay. Hopefully she isn't anorexic. Talk to her, tell her your concerns, tell her how much you care about her and that you want to see her healthy, but don't blame her. Sending good vibes your way.

"A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination." -Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Hi everyone!

I have somewhat of a problem on my hands. Here's a little background, ever since I found NF and MDA I've been getting on the healthy train building muscle, getting stronger and overall getting healthier. My significant other also jumped on with me and we've both accomplished a lot. She's got a completely new wardrobe that is many sizes smaller (clothing size, not wardrobe size) and she's really happy about that. Unfortunately lately she's gotten really obsessive about getting on the scale and freaking out if it even budges up a little bit. It's gotten to the point where she's weighing herself at every opportunity she gets and starting to move on a really unhealthy trend. I actually fear that she may start becoming anorexic if I don't intervene and a more drastic way. I'm positive she's eating less than 1500 calories a day and now she's constantly tired and grouchy as well. I've tried explaining paleo but she refuses to believe that any fat could be good fat. I don't know how to help her out. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Hey jabbajac. That sounds like a tough situation. Have you tried breaking the scale to ween her off of it? Or have her start keeping a photo log of her progress. That way she can see the difference add up and come around to the idea that weight fluctuations are normal. Or if she records the data, make a graph like Waldo shows above and draw the trend line. Visual aids help.

We'd like to see her have a healthy relationship with the scale more than anything else.

Edit: Yup. Everything Victoria said above is great and much more eloquent than I.

"Pull the bar like you're ripping the head off a god-damned lion" - Donny Shankle

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I'm not a fad dieter... I've lost body fat just by getting rid of simple carbs...

Low Carb is the flavor of the decade in fad dieting.

It works, and well for many because low-carb eating makes it difficult to consume enough calories to offset your metabolism.

If they lose weight then they have a caloric deficit. The reason they work is that it is way easier to overeat on carbs than protein and fat. There can be advantages in satiety, and they are good for strength programs due to high protein, but they only lose weight if you end up restricting calories.

GrimmThing - Warrior

Maybe I'm just too dumb to collapse - - too ugly to die !! I'll let you figure out the reasons...

Current ChallengeNF Workout Log

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Low Carb is the flavor of the decade in fad dieting.

It works, and well for many because low-carb eating makes it difficult to consume enough calories to offset your metabolism.

If they lose weight then they have a caloric deficit. The reason they work is that it is way easier to overeat on carbs than protein and fat. There can be advantages in satiety, and they are good for strength programs due to high protein, but they only lose weight if you end up restricting calories.

So you're suggesting that paleo eating is a fad diet then.

I'm not gonna keep getting off-topic here though. This isn't the point of the thread. I've already thrown in my thoughts on how to proceed with the problem here, regardless of which kind of dieting would be best for the person in the situation or how they measure or whatever other factor isn't involved in fixing a potential eating disorder.

Profession: Level 3 Sith Assassin, Slingshot Demon Slayer (Rank: Spy)Stats: STR 6 DEX 5.25 CON 9 STA 2 WIS 6.5 CHA 1Motto: Do you really want it? Luchar por ella.Links: Six Week Challenge | Life GoalsQOTD: HA! "Your Honor, permission to Kong Vault over the bench?" -- AtSeaLevel

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The OP's post doesn't really indicate any specifics. What are her goals? Does he even know. I mean, if she's near her goal and really focused on it and not severely undereating (without a lot of exercise, under 1500 calories is perfectly viable for a female), her behavior could be perfectly normal. If you are trying to push Paleo on someone that has had success other ways (which seems to be the case), expect serious pushback.

She's already lost beyond her goal weight. She doesn't really understand paleo but I don't try and push it on her, she just adapted to most of it. Some meal's she'll eat well and other's she just spends eating all fruits. An example would be she would have a large pear for breakfast, 2 persimmons for lunch and then we'd do a steak dinner together. I guess that could be normal and I'm not as concerned about that as I am for her psychological standpoint where she gets freaked out whenever she see's the scale move up.

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Hey, dude; recovering anorexic here. If you love her, and you think she is developing a serious problem, you have to help her. Unfortunately, know that if she is anorexic (here are some common warning signs ), you might lose her in the process, because if she has made the decent into obsession... intervening isn't going to be pretty. It's just as bad as breaking a drug or alcohol addiction, and she will fight you every step of the way. It really is best to seek professional help. Know that if she is anorexic, the only way she will get help is if she realizes she is sick and decides she *wants* to get help. There is nothing you can do to force it on her, but make your concern known.

It sounds like this has just started, so... if she is reading fitness blogs at all, point her toward this great post about metabolic damage, it does a good job of explaining the damage eating nothing does, without sounding accusatory. If she's just really conscious of her health and is just misguided, it could go a long way to discourage the calorie restriction habit. That blogger is also really great at talking about body image issues, etc in a good way and not in a... way that encourages a negative mindset (I won't name names, but... there is a ton of pro-ana stuff out there that is very subtle in it's promotion).

Really, if she is going down the path of anorexia, the only way she's going to get better is if she talks to a professional. It's an illness, it can't be fixed by well-meaning friends. I can tell you now, I never sought help for anorexia, because it was my "best friend." The fact that I came by help for my disorder was purely by coincidence (I went through a very traumatic experience and got stuck in crisis counselling, and there we worked on a whole slew of issues beyond my PTSD, including my negative body image and self-destructive eating habits). I was sick for 7 years and no one in my life ever spoke up; I honestly don't know if I would have sought help if they had, but... saying something now and maybe getting through to her has got to be better than watching her slowing kill herself and knowing you did nothing.

I really hope this turns out okay. Hopefully she isn't anorexic. Talk to her, tell her your concerns, tell her how much you care about her and that you want to see her healthy, but don't blame her. Sending good vibes your way.

Thanks for the advice. She acknowledges that her thought pattern is similar to anorexia so I think I can start from there and see what I can do in terms of professional help.

Thanks for the advice guys!

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Hey, Tough situation you’re in. As a teen I was anorexic for about 3 years before being hospitalised. I was still under my parents care so I think that might make it easier than in a relationship but something my family (and friends) did to help me, and some that you could implement are

- Take away the scale - this one was a real blow to me but once it was gone I wasn’t weighing myself 3+ times a day

- Encourage her to go see a nutritionist (preferably one with a background in eating disorders) and get a meal plan made up - if she’s following it to the letter (and you have to encourage her to do that, and possibly modify your eating habits to help her for a short period) then she will at least be getting enough calories. This also helped me personally with the control issues I had with food as I still was able to feel like I had some type of control. If she is eating really low-cal don't increase it too dramatically at first or she will freak out when she gains weight quickly and then increase it every few weeks/months in a healthy way.

- See a professional with a strong background in eating disorders, preferably female. This one is super important.

- If she has a meal plan made up, help her with preparing the meals and having them ready. This helped me because I was skipping breakfast and lunches under the excuse I don’t have time, if you have it their ready for her, it takes away one less excuse. Also if you can find the time to eat together (difficult at lunch if you’re at work) but even just having breakfast and dinner together helps.

- Everything Victoriaoke said.

Hope you guys can work though this together

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Try to get her to see the trend as more important than the individual weigh-ins, as has been mentioned, a fluctuation here or there doesn't matter as long as the trend is going in the intended direction.

Also, weigh at the same time(s) each day, under as close as possible to the same conditions so that the comparisons are like for like. If you weigh yourself before breakfast today, and after breakfast tomorrow you might think you've gained weight. This will have the benefit of getting her to not jump on the scale at any whim, and reduce her dependancy on it.

But I really like ally's suggestion of seeing a nutritionist. Whether her goal is to loose further fat, or maintain her weight, or whatever, then they'll find the healthiest way for her to approach it, and coming from a professional will have a greater infulence than coming from you or us.

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For me, I get a little obsessed with the scale because I've done the yo-yo weight loss thing. And the weight FEELS LIKE it come back all of a sudden. I'm tall enough that 10-15 pounds doesn't show up (gain or loss) in my clothes. This summer I stopped weighing regularly and now I'm up 15 pounds. And of course that gain was a lot easier than it's been to lose. So I WISH I'd been more diligent and caught it at 5. (And many would argue that even a 5 pound variance isn't worth worrying about.)

So how do you balance it?

My guess is the switch from constantly seeing losses(and having the reward/celebrate response), to seeing maintenance (neutral response) or gains (panic response!), is what's causing the problem. It's hard to adjust from a lot of celebrating to all neutral/negative internal responses.

It's also hard when you do see the small (or medium) fluctuations to determine if it's water versus fat/real weight gain.

Maybe understanding why she's worried would help. If she's worried about gaining the weight back, I agree with what others have said and like using a chart. That's working for me now. I weigh myself once a day at the same time, same conditions. And record it and try to stay unemotional as I record it. Then later in the day, after the success/shock of the weigh in has worn off, I'll look at trends. (I've even started tracking girlie cycles, which has helped (not just for weight but for strength, moods, etc.)). It's helped me be less emotional and more science-driven.

But simply telling someone who's lost weight to stop weighing might seem very insensitive to their work toward losing weight, and make her defensive. It's possible she feels a little out of control, and finding a less emotioanl way to approach it might be a breath of fresh air.

Shape-Shifting Ginger
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2" washers for smaller weight increases

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