BopGun tries to lose bodyfat and get stronger (in that order)

[BopGun]

I haven't been around NF much at all in the last several months, but I'm glad to be back now.

 

When I joined NF this past summer, I determined that, come the New Year, I'd start to lift weights for the first time in my life. I'm 6'3", weight fluctuates between 225 and 230. I played many different sports as a kid but thoroughly sucked at all of them -- except bowling, which at high levels requires more mental ability than physical skill -- and was bullied because of it. My overwhelmingly negative experiences with physical activity have led to more than 16 years with no regular exercise.

 

I wanted to wait to begin lifting because of my clubfeet and the surgeries I needed as a child in order to walk normally. (My left ankle doesn't dorsiflex enough to allow my knee to track over my toes. My right ankle isn't much better. Good luck squatting with that. I couldn't even do it as a toddler.) Since joining NF, I have tried physical therapy. It did nothing. I tried two 30-minute sessions of mobility work and stretching per day, every day for two months, along with the PT. It didn't help. Basically, I'm stuck with this shit and I have to work around it as best I can.

 

I didn't want this to completely deter me, so I asked for (and received) a pair of weightlifting shoes for Christmas. I joined a gym yesterday and picked up free weights today for the first time.

 

And...a small part of me wishes I hadn't.

 

Squats - 45

5/3

Bench Press - 30 (15# dumbbells)

5X5

No barbell rows this time...every muscle in my body below the neck is sore even without them, and my legs are quivering.

 

Good LORD, did that bar feel HEAVY when I unracked it for squats! I tried my best not to stagger, but it wobbled a little bit on every rep. I also realized on my first rep that even the 1.5" heels of my weightlifting shoes wouldn't be enough help for my ankles, so I stuck 10-pound plates under each heel along with them. (I realize that this is a bad idea if you use weightlifting shoes...but frankly, the squats just weren't going to happen without them.)

 

My knees wobbled as I tried my best to shove them out. The first set fried my quads and hamstrings so much that I drank 90% of the water I brought with me in about 10 seconds. Then, on the second set, I couldn't get out of the hole on rep #4, fell backward when I tried to push out of it and whacked the back of my head on the bar when it hit the pins. On second thought, maybe the squats SHOULDN'T have happened. I'm scaling them back next time.

 

I realized at that point that if I couldn't squat the bar, I probably wouldn't be able to bench it, either, so I pulled out the 15# dumbbells. The first four sets were a piece of cake, but the last one almost didn't happen, so I'm glad I scaled it down.

 

At this stage, I was so tired and sore that I didn't want to leave the bench, but eventually I did. Something I didn't expect...not only are my legs quivering along with the soreness in my triceps, delts and chest, but my wrists and even forearms are sore, too. Didn't expect that.

 

Sorry about the length. All of this is so new to me that I'm likely to forget if I don't type it. The 20 minutes in the gym were a huge learning experience, and I intend to keep learning.

 

(Edited on 8/31/14 to change thread title.)

[This is Seth]

...I hate to be the one who has to tell you about DOMS. You'll probably feel just as wonderful tomorrow. But, that's a good thing.

Congrats on starting this journey. It seems you might have an extra hurdle to get over when it comes to some of the big lifts because of your ankle mobility. First thing that I wonder is if a "sumo stance" dead lift would be easier for you. Look that one up, it may allow you to ease up on the need to track knees over toes.

[BopGun]

LOL. Thanks, Seth. Unfortunately I am quite familiar with Mr. DOMS. I've made two attempts in my adult life to delve into bodyweight strength training (one was about ten years ago and the other was last April). Had to abandon both of them after about a month because I was too eager to press on after Mr. DOMS showed his face and I hurt myself. I'm determined to not do that this time.

 

I've read up every now and then on your meat tanking adventures (heh) and I hope your challenge goes well! I'm also from MA (from near Springfield originally; I live in Michigan now) and I was a soccer goalkeeper for a little while, though not at anywhere near your level.

[BopGun]

Ugh. My upper body and my hamstrings were OK going into the weight room three hours ago, but my quads were still so sore going in that i couldn't walk without a limp. That, combined with having to drive an hour and a half each way for work today as opposed to my usual 15 minutes, meant I didn't have as much in the tank as I would have liked.

 

Squat -- BW -- 5x5 with admittedly crap form that I held as best I could with my sore, aching quads

Squat form will be the bane of my existence...I need to get coaching locally.

OHP -- 20 (10# dumbbells) -- 5x5

Almost didn't get the last set; the last three reps made my delts ache but I was able to hold form.

 

I will, in fact, add barbell rows and deadlifts in there; however, I'd like to not be totally destroyed by minimal weights on the other exercises first. Certainly hope that happens soon. Hell, even though these two workouts were both brief, I have yet to see anyone in my gym (a Y) deadlifting or doing any barbell rows, so I don't even know if they're allowed. The layout of the weight room doesn't leave a hell of a lot of floor space in which to do them, so they may not be. I need to ask.

 

I also came into this with the intent of working out in the morning. Uh, no. As Damon Wayans would say, homey don't play that, not when these admittedly minimal workouts sap all energy that I have for the remainder of the day, as they're doing now.

[This is Seth]

The general rule when lifting heavy things is: "Do it till someone tells you to stop." I'm rather sure that the trainers at my gym frown upon my use of chalk, but until someone specifically tells me to stop, I will continual to use it.

Move shit out of your way and dead lift to your hearts content.

[BopGun]

Seth, part of me thought that was the case, but I obviously wasn't sure, so thanks for the encouragement.

 

I already was going to move shit out of the way tonight...and as if to further encourage me, a pair of high school-age girls were deadlifting when I walked out of the locker room. They're the first people in my gym I've seen deadlifting (including a myriad of massive guys in their 20s). Good on them.
 
Of course, I have yet to see anyone else lifting in anything other than running shoes.

 

 

Can't have everything.

 

I'm somewhat sore, of course, and was breathing hard and dripping with sweat when I left the weight room, but I do feel pretty good.

 

Squats -- BW -- 5x5 with less wobbling than last time, but still bad.

Shoving the knees out is a problem. (TIGHT adductors that refuse to stretch no matter how often I do the Rippetoe-suggested stretch holding the knees out with the elbows; that position nearly feels like I'm going to tear something. Not quite, but it's close).

Using the hips first before bending the knees is a problem.

Depth is a BIG problem.

You've heard this before...but I've gotta say it one time. I. Hate. Squats. Hate hate hate hate hate.

 

Bench Press -- 45 -- 5x5

I thought tonight that I may have been able to press the bar on Sunday...and it now looks like I could have.

 

Barbell Rows -- 65 -- 5x5

First time doing them. Form wasn't the best. The last set was very tough. Anything heavier than this would not have happened. I'll have to keep using the same weight and work on form...just like squats.

 

I probably won't be able to hit the gym again until Tuesday...leaving tomorrow for a long weekend that I'll post about in the woot room.

[BopGun]

Felt good tonight to be back in the gym after my trip to Chicago to (unsuccessfully) audition for The Voice forced me to go without since Friday.

 

Squat - BW - 5x5

I had gone without plates under the heels in my last two workouts. Went back to them tonight and was immediately glad I did. Depth much better as a workaround for my semi-corrected clubfeet. Much less wobbling. It feels like 5x10 will be possible on Sunday.

 

Overhead Press - 30 (15# dumbbells) - 5x5

I thought I had enough in me for the 15s after the 10s last time (instead of a 25# plate), and I did. Barely.

Form degenerated on the last couple of reps. Will stick with the 15s one more time, and if form holds through them, I'll see if I can do the empty bar after that.

 

BTW, it SUCKS to be a 6'3" man with the strength of a 9-year-old girl.

 

Sumo DL - 95 - 1x5

 

Seth suggested sumo deadlifts would be worth looking into...and whaddaya know? Sumo stance feels several orders of magnitude more natural to me (short torso, VERY long arms and legs to go along with my gimpy feet) than conventional.

[BopGun]

Squat - BW - 5x5

Felt pretty stable for a change and smoother than they did previously. Going to 5x10 on Sunday, and if that goes well for a week, the empty bar returns (gulp...pleeeeeeeeeease don't crush me to death and make me sore for four days like last time).

 

Bench - 50 - 5x5

Felt good to have weight on the bar in another exercise, even if it's a single 2.5# plate on each side. Form feels really good.

 

Barbell Rows - 65 - 5x5

Same weight as last time in order to improve technique. Form did feel better than last time, but I'm still unsatisfied with it. My starting position sucks balls, though I have no problem with what actually needs to be done to get the weight up. I have to keep practicing.

[BopGun]

Squat - BW - 5x10

 

Oof. Big challenge here. Had to fight very hard to get out of the hole on the last few reps in sets 4 and 5, but I did it.

 

Overhead Press - 45 - 5x5

 

After three days of rest, I didn't know if the empty bar would be within my capabilities, but I thought I'd try...and to my surprise, it was.

 

Conventional DL - 100 - 1x5

 

Only my second time ever deadlifting. Conventional was much easier this time than last; I'd tried it before settling on sumo out of frustration at my rounded back. After studying the technique at some length, I think I did a much better job on the way up this time, but I still had a lot of trouble getting back down without the back rounding. Bleh.

[BopGun]

Squats - BW - 5x10

Bench - 55 - 5x5

Barbell Rows - 70 - 5x5

 

Was still hungry last night after dinner; it's been -10 out two days in a row. I had a shit-ton of venison sausage to quell my hunger and teh proteinz must have really helped. MUCH easier workout than Sunday...especially the rows.

 

Hmm...I still have some venison left in my freezer.

[BopGun]

Squat - BW - 5x10

Form is slowly improving, w/less wobbling and more and more reps each time on which I can keep the knees shoved out as far as I can. I still think I need another week of them before putting the bar on my back, though. I want to keep hammering away at technique and make sure I only need a minute of rest between each set before I load up my back. (I'm down now to 1 min for each of the first three rests and 1:30 for the last one.)

 

OHP - 45 - 5x5

Likewise, with better form than last time. I'm finally loading the bar with a little weight next time.

 

DL - 105 - 1x5

Still having trouble with the correct way to get back down. My body wants to bend at the knees first and I can't seem to convince it to do otherwise.

 

Just bought a boatload of milk and chicken breasts on the way home from the gym, as I know I need to change my diet, too. I still have one more biiiiiiiiiiiig serving of venison in the freezer and I'm already looking forward to having it tomorrow night.

[BopGun]

While looking on Friday for something else, I happened to find this:

 

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/does_everyone_need_to_squat_deep

 

...and I realized, "oh, so THAT'S what that tucking-under-of-the-hips is that I have on every BW squat rep I try. Butt wink. Terrific."   It also occurred to me that I have to fix it before I can even consider loading up my back. I bought a PVC pipe for 'foam' rolling earlier this week and I'm using it on all my lower body extremities and my lower back. I also just started doing planks on Friday at least twice a day...and 10 seconds in one is enough to leave my core trembling from the strain. The longest I can hold one right now is 20 seconds before collapsing from fatigue.

 

I also have a session with a personal trainer in an hour, as I can't do this any longer without some in-person coaching. My body is so weak, rigid and out of shape that it doesn't know how to function properly. Ugh.

[BopGun]

What a colossal waste of time. I cared so little for the circuit of Cybex machines the trainer put me through that I don't even remember what they were, what weights I was doing or how many sets and reps.

 

I'm pissed off and will go into some more detail about that elsewhere.

[This is Seth]

Two things to get to. But first, fuck personal trainers. They're there to make you sweat in the most legally safe way possible, no matter how little work your body actually does.

 

Okay, on to the real issues. One, squatting BW vs squatting with a bar is a huge difference. The body itself is in a complete different position. How long is that PVC pipe that you bought? Use that as a makeshift bar. Or a broom. Or a really long carrot. Anything really, you just want to get your body back into the position to receive the bar up on your meat shelf and figure out how far back you should be sitting when you squat down.

 

Secondly, dead lifts and putting the bar back down gently. Here's the thing, there are two types of people that make a lot of noise at the gym: the guy who wants to make a scene so that people see how much he's lifting and then there's the guy that knows that the chance of hurting himself putting weight down slowly is exponentially raised. Just drop the weight... reasonably. 

 

Here's what you wanna do, you're standing in locked out position really wanting to get that heavy bar out of your hands. You most likely have your cheeks clenched, as that's a great physical cue for the top of your lockout; you want to unclench and imagine your about to sit down on the shitter. Push your hips back two to three inches, just shove them back, think of it as unlocking motion. From here, think of moving your shoulders forward at the same rate your hips are moving back, nice and slow. Once that bar hits your knees, let that thing go. It's only falling a foot or two, it won't be too loud as long as you keep your hands on it and it's safer on your lower back to let it bring itself down to the floor.

 

Keep up the good work.

[BopGun]

Again, Seth, thanks for the ideas. The pipe is two feet long, the longest section of 4-inch-diameter pipe I could find around here. (It was either that or one foot.) I might just be able to keep that thing in place on my back as I work on the sitting back. If three weeks ago was any indication, I need to sit much farther back than I initially realized.

 

Also, yeah, I don't know how in the hell I managed to miss the proper way back down in the deadlift, but you're right; I did miss it. Looks like I need to read my copy of SS 3rd edition again.

 

The work has certainly been hard, the most difficult physical thing I've ever tried in my life, but I wouldn't call it 'good' yet... not with as much of a washout as my lower body is. Time for PVC rolling, a plank and then bed.

[BopGun]

Squat - 45 - 5x5 but with technique and depth that would probably make your eyeballs bleed if you saw it.

I also ditched the 10# plates under the heels this time. Maybe I shouldn't have.

I swear, I really do try to shove my knees out and they shove out maybe an inch before caving right back in.

Same with depth. I descend as far as I possibly can and it's probably no lower than half-depth.

I'm not even going to THINK about increasing the weight next time.

 

The one saving grace this time is that the empty bar didn't feel so heavy that I thought it was going to crush me to death, which was how it felt three weeks ago.

 

Bench - 60 - 5x5

 

Bent-Over Row - 75 - 5x5

 

I was surprised at how easily the weight went up on both of these.

[BopGun]

Squat - 45 w/10# plates under heels - 5x5

 

OHP - 55 - 5x5

 

DL - 115 - 1x5

 

On the one hand, I count three positives tonight.

 

1) I was already wiped out before I got to the gym and wasn't sure I could do this tonight. I had to spend half the day outdoors in single-digit temperatures while it was snowing sideways. The last 90 minutes of that involved digging the company car I was using out of a snowbank, without a shovel, halfway up the access road of a ski hill.

 

2) I'm really starting to like deadlifts. A lot.

 

3) Though it may still have been just the empty bar, it was nice to actually get 5x5 with decent depth on a squat weight that caused me to collapse earlier this month before I could do 2x5 with it.

 

On the other hand, I'm beginning to wonder if my congenital issues and my 16 years of inactivity leave me totally hopeless in terms of ever getting the hang of squat technique. It's a train wreck...I know what my body is supposed to do, but damned if I can actually do it. I'm still uncomfortable increasing the weight yet.

 

I'm asking around the gym tomorrow who the best trainer they have is for squat form coaching.

[This is Seth]

Where are your toes pointed? Have you tried messing with the angles of your feet to get better depth?

And just remember, before you pay the trainer, make sure they are a firm believer of at least below parallel squatting. If he/she prefers ass to ground squatting, hug them then pay them.

[BopGun]

I've been using a 30-degree point outward with the toes. Probably time to try 45 or so...

 

...and you know the bottom position stretch that Rip has in SS (in the 3rd edition it's figure 2-13, on page 21)? I cannot get into that position while standing. Every time I try it (and it's been quite a few times now), I fall right on my ass. When I get into that position while seated and hold the knees out as recommended, the stretch is so powerful that it almost feels like I'm going to tear something. Not quite, but almost. I have been working on tissue along with everything else, but not for long enough to notice any difference. PVC rolling is EXTREMELY painful. Guess that means I badly need it.

 

I haven't ponied up a dime yet...trying, actually, to convince them to give me one more free session since the initial session was such a bust. Didn't have time to make my inquiries at the gym yesterday, either; my day was thrown upside down by breaking news that I had to spend most of the day (and into the night) chasing.

[This is Seth]

Alright, as far as figure 2-13 is concerned how far forward is your gut? Look at 2-14, see how far forward he's leaning in that example? Have you watched any of the MWoD videos? Lots of questions, sorry.

The opening video for the mobility workout of the day is the ten minute squat test. This thing is devastating to the inflexible, it's also a great benchmark for how deep you should be able to go in a squat.

PVC rolling hurts everyone. I use a foam one, cause I'm a big baby... hope your IRL stuff washes out cleanly.

[BopGun]

Seth, now that you call my attention to the lean, yeah, I do now see that. I had never noticed it previously and had/have not been leaning forward much, if at all.

 

I have watched quite a few MWOD videos...including the 10-min test, actually...but I've never tried the 10-min test. When i see things like that, I automatically think 'hey, that's great; I see the efficacy of that, but as fucked-up as my legs and feet are I doubt it would be any help to me'. It appears I need to disabuse myself of that notion.

 

And don't apologize for the questions. I appreciate all of the thoughtin'. It gets me thoughtin' about the proper things.

[BopGun]

Just for ha-has, I tried the MWOD 10-minute squat test after typing the previous post and before PVC rolling and bed. It took me 27 minutes. Oof. Had to hold onto a door frame to do it. Double oof. Looks like I have something else to work on.

 

Squat - 45 w/no heel plates - 5x5

Technique is still crappy, which means weight is still in no position to increase, but I think this was slightly better. My ass is more sore than it's been previously, so I think I did a little better job this time of getting the knees out. My left heel came off the ground a hair toward the bottom, though. (My left foot was more severely clubbed than my right. From what I've seen and read about those of you with more normal feet, I'd estimate that I have 75-80% of normal mobility in my right ankle and just 25-30% in my left.)

 

Bench - 45 - 2x5

65 - 5x5

 

Bent-Over Rows - 85 - 5x5

Wasn't until I finished and took out my notepad that I realized I made a 10# jump on this instead of 5. So that was why the last set was so challenging...

[BopGun]

Now I know how a truly shitty day in the weight room feels. My boss decided she didn't feel like working today, so I unexpectedly had to stay an hour late at work, which in turn meant that I had to rush over to the gym to get my workout in before it closed. This means I was lifting weights at almost 8 pm when I hadn't eaten since 1. Oh, and I've also shortchanged myself on sleep the last two nights. Think I was feeling a little sluggish?

 

On the plus side, my utter failure with my squat reps gave me an idea of what to try next...and I think I need to switch to it for a little while to work on technique.

 

Squat - 45, nothing under the heels, once again trying for better technique than last time - 5/5/5/3/0

 

I just didn't have much in the tank tonight. Knees were still caving in, too. I still felt as if I needed to do something else, though, so I threw in...

 

Goblet Squat - 10 - 4x5

 

Thought I'd try it after having read this and -- wouldn't you know -- depth was about a hundred times better. So that's what keeping the core tight feels like? With my Pillsbury Doughboy core, I wouldn't know. bleh. I need to do more of this before I load the back up, and I also need to keep working on knees-out.

 

OHP - 55 w/much stricter form than last time - 5/5/5/3/5

 

Argh. My third rest was too short. Went up to a 1:30 rest after that and managed the last set just fine.

 

DL - 125 - 1x5

 

It felt MUCH heavier than the 115 did last time (MUST...HAVE...FOOD... stomach was growling by this point), but I did lock all five reps out without much trouble.

[BopGun]

I ate about an hour before hitting the gym tonight and, fortunately, it now appears that Tuesday was just a momentary thing.

 

Squat - 10# Goblets - 10/10/10/9/7

 

Goblets kick my ass. Wait, who am I kidding? ANY squat variation kicks my ass. I can't brace my core, shove the knees out or reach full depth for shit. Oh, and there's buttwink, too. Can't forget that.

 

Hopefully, goblets will help..along with the planks, stretching and PVC rolling that I'm doing religiously. My (fl)abs felt sore for a few minutes after the last set. I WILL work up to squatting the bar again with much better form, depth and control than I can currently muster, then add weight, but I have to do all this much more slowly than Mehdi or Rip suggest.

 

Bench - 45 - 2x5

70 - 5x5

 

Last two sets were HARD to the point of losing good form on a rep or two. I'm sticking to my guns and not adding weight until I can do 70 with better form than this. One more should do it.

 

Bent-Over Rows - 90 - 5x5

 

The weight just FLEW up on all reps. I think I've found another exercise I actually like, to go along with DLs. Given the similarity of their setup positions, it probably makes sense that I dig both of them.

[BopGun]

Squat - 10# Goblets - 10/10/8/10/10

 

Lengthened the last two rest periods and got through it. Pleased to say that while technique still needs work, I was stricter with form this time than last, too. Really winded after these...but that means I need 'em.

 

OHP - 55 - 5x5

 

The weight was MUCH easier to handle this time than last. Will progress to 60 next time.

 

DL - 135 - 1x5

 

OK, so I finally have big-boy plates on there for one exercise, at least.