Kettlebell Addicts Support Group

[Sloth the Enduring]

I'm no expert, but since this is the internet I'll give you my opinion anyway. I think you're using your arms to get a little extra lift instead of a pop and float. Otherwise it looked good to me, it's obvious you're keeping everything tight.

[matty_mcfly]

::Sorry, work computer doesn't allow me to quote posts::

 

I agree with you, I don't really feel it in my arms or shoulders BUT I feel like the bell was going to high and I made an effort this morning to hit the same height every swing.

 

Thanks!

[The Most Loathed]

sore traps, that's probably the pop Slothlike spotted. 

[Sloth the Enduring]

I've always done straight sets simply because that's what I've always done. When and why would I do ladders or pyramids?

[Sloth the Enduring]

I'm finally reading Enter the Kettlebell. I vacillate in between, "preach it comrade!" And, "ugh. Could we have more hyperbole?"

[The Most Loathed]

I've always done straight sets simply because that's what I've always done. When and why would I do ladders or pyramids?

I don't know that I can make a case that ladders are ever "the right choice". I like to do ladders for the very same reason you do straight sets. I guess I would make a case that I can probably do more reps on a ladder going downward. A ladder upward probably gets me the same or fewer reps. I'm sure that there are studies that argue both cases. 

 

I'm finally reading Enter the Kettlebell. I vacillate in between, "preach it comrade!" And, "ugh. Could we have more hyperbole?"

I totally understand this feeling. 

[Elastigirl]

I'm finally reading Enter the Kettlebell. I vacillate in between, "preach it comrade!" And, "ugh. Could we have more hyperbole?"

Ha! I've been re-reading and thinking the same thing. My rereading has actually been more skimming with a bit of eye rolling in some parts.

[Elastigirl]

I've always done straight sets simply because that's what I've always done. When and why would I do ladders or pyramids?

ladders  and pyramids allow you to do more reps with less rest time in between them. You can do them if you have less time to workout or just to get some extra sets in during the day. In ETK Pavel has you doing presses with ladders, though you still may take a long rest in between rungs. 

 

Ladders help me to build endurance too.

[Sloth the Enduring]

Thanks, so I would do them to get in more total work, but fewer reps near failure? That sounds useful.

I actually really enjoy Pavel's writing as long as I get it in small doses.

[Elastigirl]

I like Pavel's writing too, I just kind of roll my eyes at the hyperbole. But I love the detailed description of the moves.

 

Next challenge I am doing Rite of Passage from Enter the Kettlebell. I've done it before, but I am re-reading it and working on some of the prep skills. I figured a bit of time spent relearning the basics and making sure I'm doing everything correctly is time well spent. This week is supposed to be my de-load week. Plan was not to work super hard, just practice some swinging skills and bottoms up kettlebell carries. Now I have all the DOMS. I forget that sometimes I work out harder when I'm just "practicing" and not counting reps.

[The Most Loathed]

Happy New Challenge Week!!

 

 

I was scrolling Facebook today and was reminded of the Tactical Fitness Challenge (apparently now owned by StrongFirst). This is an event I competed in years ago when Jeff Martone was doing it under Tactical Athlete (that's where the challenge name comes from). I tried to find the record of the old event but it looks like Tactical Athlete's page has no link to the challenge anymore.

 

Anyway, the idea is, max effort barbell deadlift (3 attempts), max rep non-kipping pull up and five minute kettlebell snatch test (fixation not required, multiple hand switch). You must complete all three event in one day, at least fifteen minutes rest but one hour to ninety minutes is recommended.

 

I did this years ago at a gym with my Strongman training partners. As a result we dominated the deadlift but sucked at the pull up. We were middling on the snatches, not good enough to make up for the pull up performance so we placed just north of average.

 

I'm thinking I'll do it again this fall. It looks like the event is October 5. I don't think it will count since I won't be at a StrongFirst facility. None the less, it'll be fun to see how I do. Anyone else game?

[Sloth the Enduring]

Is this event in the cities? I'd like to check it out.

[The Most Loathed]

It's done nationwide at various gyms. I think North East Kettlebells is a StrongFirst location so they will likely be hosting a local event.

[KB Girl]

Here is my form check video. Feel free to rip apart review. There are 3 sets here, which is why its 2.5 minutes. First one is 15, with some push presses. Second is 25 with presses and the third is the first 25 of the 50 swing set. Oh and I know my clean and press needs works as its not pretty at all

.

In the spirit of better late than never... I really can't say much about your swing, because I've never been taught these RKC style swings and they just look weird to me So i'm glad TML covered that. 

Your push presses really aren't so bad at all. If you pay attention to realigning your back each rep then it's all good really! Are you interested in doing good cleans? Because your current swings wouldn't translate to a good clean at all.

 

Anyway, the idea is, max effort barbell deadlift (3 attempts), max rep non-kipping pull up and five minute kettlebell snatch test (fixation not required, multiple hand switch). You must complete all three event in one day, at least fifteen minutes rest but one hour to ninety minutes is recommended.

 

I'm thinking I'll do it again this fall. It looks like the event is October 5. I don't think it will count since I won't be at a StrongFirst facility. None the less, it'll be fun to see how I do. Anyone else game?

Hmm, that sounds interesting. Am I allowed to do chin-ups?  

What weight would you use for the snatches? I hardly have any idea what I could snatch with multiple switches. Are you allowed to put it down too for a rest?

[The Most Loathed]

Hmm, that sounds interesting. Am I allowed to do chin-ups?

What weight would you use for the snatches? I hardly have any idea what I could snatch with multiple switches. Are you allowed to put it down too for a rest?

 

I couldn't find it on the new page but if it's like it used to be, 16 kg.

Set down is also allowed. the hardest part for you would be the pace change, to be successful you can't fixate and you've really got to whip the bell down.

[Elastigirl]

Tried snatch again yesterday. Struggling with the endurance issue cardio wise. I did it with the 20 #, so I was fine as far as strength, but I was trying for 2 minutes and couldn't quite make it. I had to stop because I felt like I was completely out of breath. How do you build up  for this? I don't really think I'm that bad usually as far as cardio goes, I can do sledgehammer for 15 minutes, and do tons of swings, but yikes those snatches get me.

 

Should I set the timer for 2 minutes and just keep going, trying to up my time? Or is it better to set it for 90 second then rest 20 sec or something and do several sets? How do you build the stamina?

[The Most Loathed]

This is definitely KB Girl territory so anything she says supersedes anything I have to say

 

What's your pace?

How does it feel when you are resting overhead?

Who does 2 minutes of swings feel by comparison?

 

It's my instinct that technique will make a huge difference. If you watch KBGirl's latest video, she uses a very Russian technique that works very well for protecting the hands and helping the lungs recovery. Ensuring that you relax and breath at the to is imperative. If you've got all that nailed then it's time to work on conditioning which is approached through progressive adaptation like everything else, meaning, keeping doing it for longer or with shorter breaks until it gets easier. 

[Elastigirl]

This is definitely KB Girl territory so anything she says supersedes anything I have to say

 

What's your pace?

How does it feel when you are resting overhead?

Who does 2 minutes of swings feel by comparison?

 

It's my instinct that technique will make a huge difference. If you watch KBGirl's latest video, she uses a very Russian technique that works very well for protecting the hands and helping the lungs recovery. Ensuring that you relax and breath at the to is imperative. If you've got all that nailed then it's time to work on conditioning which is approached through progressive adaptation like everything else, meaning, keeping doing it for longer or with shorter breaks until it gets easier. 

I think maybe I just try and do as many as possible, maybe I need to slow it down. Yea, just watching KB's vid helped me see where I need to work on my form

[Vector]

I do my snatches GS style, as the hard style snatch just makes no sense to me.

 

Given that, to build up to lots of reps I used a big wall clock with a sweep second hand (this is what I learned from the AKC). Start with an easy number for you, be that five or six, whatever. Divided the minute by that number. So lets say it's six snatches. Now do those six over the course of a minute. Start when the second hand is at 12 o'clock, do your first snatch, hold it at the top until the second had is at 2 o'clock, send it down & snatch, hold it at the top, send it down & snatch at 4 o'clock, etc, etc. It's great for the shoulder & traps as well, due to the time in the top position. Do a couple of one minute sessions, with a few-ten minutes break between, then add 10, 20, 30 seconds. Speed up over time, to 8 in a minute, ten in a minute, but always controlling the pace. It's a very interesting way to train, which I have not done for years and should!

[KB Girl]

I couldn't find it on the new page but if it's like it used to be, 16 kg.

Set down is also allowed. the hardest part for you would be the pace change, to be successful you can't fixate and you've really got to whip the bell down.

Ah actually, GS style you could do 25 reps a minute with fixation for like 0.02 seconds.. Is 125 a good score?

 

Tried snatch again yesterday. Struggling with the endurance issue cardio wise. I did it with the 20 #, so I was fine as far as strength, but I was trying for 2 minutes and couldn't quite make it. I had to stop because I felt like I was completely out of breath. How do you build up  for this? I don't really think I'm that bad usually as far as cardio goes, I can do sledgehammer for 15 minutes, and do tons of swings, but yikes those snatches get me.

 

Should I set the timer for 2 minutes and just keep going, trying to up my time? Or is it better to set it for 90 second then rest 20 sec or something and do several sets? How do you build the stamina?

I honestly think you're just not breathing.. I mean sure, snatches are hard for your endurance, but it doesn't seem like you should have that much trouble. Try breathing in a pattern; one or two breath(s) in the top position, exhale on your way down, inhale on your way up. And repeat. 

 

Vector's suggestion is also good for learning how to pace. However I would never do 6 reps per minute, that's far to slow for a snatch and would require too much from your top position hold. For beginners I use simply pacing by breathing as above. (pace by number of breaths in the top hold). Then after that I start people on 12 reps a minute (every 5 seconds). 

 

For building endurance we use a 40/40/40 pattern. So, 40 seconds with right hand, 40 seconds with left hand, 40 seconds rest. Start with 8 sets. But this is only useful if you're actually breathing

[Elastigirl]

Ah actually, GS style you could do 25 reps a minute with fixation for like 0.02 seconds.. Is 125 a good score?

 

I honestly think you're just not breathing.. I mean sure, snatches are hard for your endurance, but it doesn't seem like you should have that much trouble. Try breathing in a pattern; one or two breath(s) in the top position, exhale on your way down, inhale on your way up. And repeat. 

 

Vector's suggestion is also good for learning how to pace. However I would never do 6 reps per minute, that's far to slow for a snatch and would require too much from your top position hold. For beginners I use simply pacing by breathing as above. (pace by number of breaths in the top hold). Then after that I start people on 12 reps a minute (every 5 seconds). 

 

For building endurance we use a 40/40/40 pattern. So, 40 seconds with right hand, 40 seconds with left hand, 40 seconds rest. Start with 8 sets. But this is only useful if you're actually breathing

Thanks. I think you are right. I think I just get so focused on the movement, I forget about that breathing thing

[KB Girl]

Yea actually everyone does that at first, completely normal usually I stand next to the person and breath along with them very loudly in the right pattern. That usually fixes things and is how I was taught as well.

[Vector]

I agree that six is WAY to low, it was just easy to describe!

[Elastigirl]

@KBGirl; I wish you could come next to me and breathe .  

 

I video'd my swings. I'd love input on how I can improve my form.

 

[KB Girl]

Your form is actually good for a 2 handed rkc-style swing! (Right TML?)

It just won't translate well to doing cleans or snatches. If that's your goal then i'd recommend starting with 1 handed swings right away, here are the things to watch for; 

 

- lean back a little during the swing

- activate your shoulder, but not your elbow (this is _not_ a high pull and we really don't want to go there) however if your elbow bends on its own a little bit, thats ok, good even.

- pull your hips backward instead of pushing them forward. (MOST IMPORTANT POINT!)* 

 

And theres a good way to check if you're doing all this correctly, because then it should stay closer to the body. If it is indeed closer to the body you should be able to swing along your free arm and touch the ball of the kettlebell with it. You can't do that when you swing it forward and away from you with your hips. 

 

Hope that helps

 

*this should be very clearly visible in my snatch video, i pull my hips backward, and the hip on which side the kettlebell is on pulls even a little bit harder which is why i go diagonal a little bit.