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FATLOSS BASICS


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I don't care if you are into keto, paleo, low carb, slow carb, high carb, no carb, eating for a marathon, pregnant, a powerlifter, a bodybuilder, a wizard, or any of that.  These principals are the most important factors in losing weight.  All successful weight loss/body recomposition programs dictate that you do these things, even if they don't state it outright.  If you do them, you are off to a great start.

 

  1. Eat a shit ton of vegetables.
  2. Drink a lot of water.  Then drink some more.
  3. Eat less than you burn.
  4. Move around more than you normally do.
  5. Stop eating garbage.

There is a lot of contention between the various groups, but let's get real.  These are universal truths. 

 

To be a little more specific:

 

  1. Eat a shit ton of vegetables.  Most people don't eat enough veggies.  Some don't eat any.  That's pretty stupid.  Veggies have everything you need, including fiber, vitamins, and protein.  They are more filling than most other foods, and leave less room for crap that you don't need anyways.
  2. Drink a lot of water.  Then drink some more.  Soda is not water.  Juice is not water.  They contain water, but they are not water, and are not water alternatives.  Most people don't drink enough water.  Some don't drink any.  That too, is pretty stupid.
  3. Eat less than you burn.  Regardless of what diet you adhere to, scientifically you cannot lose weight unless there is a defecit.  For some people, paleo is a great way to achieve this.  For others, it's rice and beans.  For others still, eating Subway is a good option.  Any way you achieve this goal, however you manage it, it's the only way that weight loss is going to happen.  You can track, or don't.  Tracking is a safer option, but there's a lot of people on here that don't, and that seems to work well for them.  Just eat less.  Eating more got you fat, so the solution should seem rather obvious.
  4. Move around more than you normally do.  Diet is the main avenue to fatloss, but your body needs to be active.  Lifting weights, cardio, bodyweight exercise, or just going for a walk, it's all tools in your belt that will help you get there.
  5. Stop eating garbage.  Again, I don't care what camp you are in.  We can all agree that Cheetos, Reese's, and Twinkies are not really food, and nobody needs them.  Can you carb-load with some Cap'n Crunch?  Sure.  Does someone trying to lose weight need to carb load?  Probably not.  Let's cut the semantic bullshit and be clear here:  There is such a thing as garbage food, and it usually comes vacuum wrapped in a plastic bag.  Stop eating it.

I'm only posting this to get it out of my system because I see a lot of the same non-arguments on here that are missing the bigger picture.  I'm guilty of this myself.  I'm just trying to clear the air a little and maybe give some people a nudge in the right direction.  If this comes off as pretentious or assholey, then I'm sorry.  But not really.  No matter what dietary plan you are on, if you aren't doing these things, you are doing something very wrong, and probably won't have much success, if any.

 

Thanks for listening to me rant.

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I wouldn't say that protein is a must for weight loss. But anybody who is planning on not losing muscle weight should up protein.

 

I agree with everything, but I think they are better in this order. If someone sees this and plans on following them. Doing the first then the second etc is the best progression imo.

 

Drink a lot of water

Eat less than you burn.

Move around more than you do

Eat more vegetables

Stop eating garbage

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I didn't want to get into the specifics of macro nutrients, because that scope-creeps into areas of debate.  I also didn't do this in any particular order, I just numbered it so it looked like I meant business.

 

Protein, like all macro nutrients is important.  But unless you're a raw fruitarian or you eat rocks, you're getting protein.  I wanted to make the most important points that really can't be left up for debate.  All macro nutrients are important.  This is about the bigger picture.

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Preach it Brother Gorilla!

But why water? I realize soda isn't water, but how does it help you lose weight?

 

Less that it helps you lose weight, more that if you think  you are hungry, grabbing a glass of water instead sometimes can override the urge to eat.  From what I understand, sometimes the body mistakes dehydration for hunger, so a glass of water fixes that, taking away the 'hunger' pains.  Worst case scenario is you find out you're *still* hungry, at which point you eat and are for fed and watered for a bit more.

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Fat loss begins with setting appropriate goals.  Your list is a way to achieve those goals.    Number five (garbage?) isn't really all that important if you have combination number three and number four working together.  Numbers one and four are solid advice for any healthy diet.

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Soooo what about protein? Seems it should be included in there somewhere...

Protein is not one of the basics. Now it can play a big role in the difference between a cut beach body and a skinnyfat, but for someone obese trying to become less obese, it is inconsequential.

The leaner you are, the more important it becomes. Muscle loss is irrelevant until you drop below the obese line. As dietary things go it is also fairly difficult; it takes time to learn the protein count of various foods and morph your diet into a higher protein diet. Most people will need to supplement with protein shakes for some time before they can hit the typically recommended minimum intake (0.8g/lb LBM) from diet alone regularly.

First things first get the basics down and have a couple months of success with the basics, then move on to protein.

currently cutting

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Show me one person that scarfs down deep-fried twinkies or cheetos on a cut.  You can do it, but it's basically self-sabotage.

Very true.

However many people are very successful picking a manageable indulgence that they allow themselves each day. It does really help to combat the "deprived" feeling. Ice cream/frozen yogurt is a commonly used example; it is easy to measure, has reasonably decent nutrition for being a "junk" food, and isn't so calorie expensive unless you eat A LOT.

currently cutting

battle log challenges: 20, 19,18,17,16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1

don't panic!

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Preach it Brother Gorilla!

But why water? I realize soda isn't water, but how does it help you lose weight?

 

Water is involved in a mind boggling amount of the body's chemical reactions, including burning fat and the various reactions to supply energy. The more fully hydrated you are, the better these work. I don't know the details, but I've found I feel a ton better and don't eat as much (because I don't feel like crap) when I'm really well hydrated.

 

Show me one person that scarfs down deep-fried twinkies or cheetos on a cut.  You can do it, but it's basically self-sabotage. 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html

 

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Very true.

However many people are very successful picking a manageable indulgence that they allow themselves each day. It does really help to combat the "deprived" feeling. Ice cream/frozen yogurt is a commonly used example; it is easy to measure, has reasonably decent nutrition for being a "junk" food, and isn't so calorie expensive unless you eat A LOT.

 

Yup. Having small indulgences are good and mentally healthy. Too restrictive diets generate a lot of guilt which isn't long term sustainable. 

 

I take point #5 to mean have a better sense of what you are eating in a holistic sense, taking care to recognise what you are stuffing down your gullet. :)

"Pull the bar like you're ripping the head off a god-damned lion" - Donny Shankle

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Let's face it.  More people are going to fail at fat loss than succeed.  Telling them what they are eating is 'garbage' when ten random people will have a different opinion on what is garbage isn't the best practice.  Create a sustainable deficit through diet and exercise, drink lots of water, and eat a shit ton of nutrient rich veggies (I would add in fruits also).  

 

I see no reason to exclude food if the exclusion leads to a situation where someone isn't likely to adhere to the deficit.  On the flip side for some a food can be a 'garbage' food simply if having some leads to having too much and they fail to adhere to their deficit.  I can't keep peanuts in the house because it is my kryptonite, but I can leave cookies, cake, chips, whatever on the counter for months in plain sight and not overeat any of them.  Peanuts probably are not considered a garbage food.  In this case exclusion is a good thing that can stop the temptation leading to better adherence.  Eliminate 'garbage' food is an individual preference, not a universal truth. 

 

I would argue the basics of fat loss begins with the correct mindset.  

What is the reason you want to lose fat?  Health, family, vanity?

Set reasonable and achievable goals.  

Create a process to achieve your goals.  This is where your universal truths become the process.

Re-evaluate and improve.

 

Show me one person that scarfs down deep-fried twinkies or cheetos on a cut.  You can do it, but it's basically self-sabotage. 

 

Fat loss or a cut?  I would argue that a cut is a more advanced version of fat loss and therefore more strictly controlled.  But that isn't in the spirit of the original post where you are talking 'fatloss basics' and universal truths.

 

I am currently on day 8 of a roughly 17 day cut.  My M-F lunch is a sandwich with processed ham, turkey, and cheese.  A bunch of carrot sticks, a bag of chips, and a protein granola bar.  How is that sabotaging my efforts?  Last night I finished dinner with my protein macro in range and leftover calories.  I ate a Snickers Ice Cream Cone in fill out my calories (and had a beer because football!).  Sure I could have had another piece of chicken, but one of those two things is much more satisfying at the end of a long day.

 

tl;dr

 

In the end maybe I'm just being contentious.  I agree with everything you wrote in the original post except number five, stop eating garbage.  I don't feel it is a universal truth because it can't be defined.

There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened.
--Douglas Adams

 

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Okay, I'll admit that bringing up cutting when my original post was about fat-loss can kind of throw people off.  So let's stick with the original context.

 

You guys that have an issue with number five are nit-picking.  Can you eat some chips with lunch?  Sure.  Did I say you can't?  Nope.  I even admitted that you can, in fact, work those foods into your diet if you stay in range, calorically.  In my original post, the point I am making, is that fat people (myself included) did not get fat by eating lean chicken, broccoli, and carrot sticks.  The crummy food (which really isn't food, for example cheetos, twinkies, etc.) are what got them there.  Can you have a small indulgence every day?  Sure.  Is it necessary for you to have a cookie every day at 12:00 pm?  Absolutely not.  Are you better off without it?  Probably. 

 

You took the spirit of the message and convoluted it with personal bias.  Most people do not have success allowing themselves small treats, because that dependancy on 'treats' is what got them fat in the first place.  They have a poor relationship with food.  If you feel like you absolutely need, need a piece of junk food, that is an issue.  If you are making the concious, informed decision to eat it, then it's not.  Cyclone, it sounds like you know what you are doing, and are probably doing great.  I know a host of roller coaster dieters that have all said "I did good today, I can have a treat" all the way into obesity.  If you lack self control and discipline, then having just a little bit becomes a very big issue.  Like a heroin addict that wants "just a taste" to "keep him straight."  I'm not exaggerating or trying to be funny.  People have real food addictions, I've been there. 

 

My point is you have to develop the level of control and self awareness to allow yourself those 'rewards.'  Or better yet, change your definition of reward so that it includes something that isn't food.  I'm speaking generally here, and kind of going off on a tangent, I know none of you said this exactly.  But then again, maybe if you did swap out that Snickers Ice Cream Cone for a piece of chicken and squirmed a bit at the end of the day, you would be slightly more satisfied at the end of the year?  Just a thought.

 

Okay, done being a dick.  Time to go sell blood to vampires.

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Protein is not one of the basics. Now it can play a big role in the difference between a cut beach body and a skinnyfat, but for someone obese trying to become less obese, it is inconsequential.

The leaner you are, the more important it becomes. Muscle loss is irrelevant until you drop below the obese line. As dietary things go it is also fairly difficult; it takes time to learn the protein count of various foods and morph your diet into a higher protein diet. Most people will need to supplement with protein shakes for some time before they can hit the typically recommended minimum intake (0.8g/lb LBM) from diet alone regularly.

First things first get the basics down and have a couple months of success with the basics, then move on to protein.

 

Yeah, I see what you are saying. I guess my only argument would be that for someone who is obese, you can distill these "basics" down to one bullet point. Eat less calories than your TDEE.

 

I guess the reason I bring up protein is for personal reasons. I wish that I had started with a plan that involved what I would consider the three basics (Eat 1,000 cal<TDEE, eat adequate protein, strength train) when I was obese. I was 340 lbs, but very strong. I did not have any body testing done, but I would love to know what my LBM back then was. My best guess is 230 lbs or so. Unfortunately, I shed 100 lbs quickly with a large deficit, almost no strength training, and probably not enough protein. My LBM after the 100 lbs loss was about 185 lbs. Then, I gained 40 lbs back, but lost it using the plan above, and my LBM did not change very much at all through the second cut.

 

 

tl:dr  I wish I had cared more about maintaining my existing muscle mass when I first started losing weight.

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I'm gonna have to try these twinkie things on my next visit to the States :)

 

The hell-hole town I grew up in sells worse things at the county fair.  Deep fried oreos, deep fried twinkies, and an unholy abomination called "fat balls" which are essentially deep fried custard and butter.  It used to be ranked one of the fattest counties in the country.  That and the crystal meth capital of the world.  No joke, the world.  Big fat rednecks making home brewed amphetamines. 

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The deep fried Mars bar (i assume you have Mars bars in America?) is as bad as it gets here, and i've only seen those in Scotland.

 

The thing i marveled at last time out was a simple snack from the petrol/gas station, the oatmeal cream pie. Its like someone was like "you know what is better than 1 cookie? 2 cookies! You know what is better than 2 cookies? 3 cookies! Now we just need to glue them together with marshmallow". They were good though.

 

Anyway, off topic, sorry.

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The deep fried Mars bar (i assume you have Mars bars in America?) is as bad as it gets here, and i've only seen those in Scotland.

 

The thing i marveled at last time out was a simple snack from the petrol/gas station, the oatmeal cream pie. Its like someone was like "you know what is better than 1 cookie? 2 cookies! You know what is better than 2 cookies? 3 cookies! Now we just need to glue them together with marshmallow". They were good though.

 

Anyway, off topic, sorry.

 

I am addicted to them. There's a table here at work that sells them for $0.50 a piece. The only thing that keeps me from their glory is calorie counting.

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Massrandir, Barkûn, Swolórin, The Whey Pilgrim
500 / 330 / 625
Challenges: 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 31 32 34 35 36 39 41 42 45 46 47 48 49 Current Challenge
"No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. What a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. " ~ Socrates
"Friends don't let friends squat high." ~ Chad Wesley Smith
"It's a dangerous business, Brodo, squatting to the floor. You step into the rack, and if you don't keep your form, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to." ~ Gainsdalf

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Preach it Brother Gorilla!

But why water? I realize soda isn't water, but how does it help you lose weight?

 

It keeps you full, it aids in all processes of the body, it's the best for quenching thirst (a lot of sodas and stuff with sugar can actually trigger hunger and cravings).  Plus, it's the original "diet" drink!  It takes up room in your stomach without being full of empty calories.  Plus, I find that drinking ice water actually can help wake me up if I'm wicked tired.  If I'm looking for flavor, I actually add a green tea or herbal tea bag.  Still nearly no calories, and no fake sweeter!  Generally, the less "fake" stuff in your body the better off you'll be.

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