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The Shogun

The Black Ribbon Thread (The Sleeping Quarters)

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58 minutes ago, The Shogun said:

Ok, guys. I'm having a bit of a problem with my sleeping pattern (sleeping hygiene?). For those who don't know, I used to live far away from my work. I used to wake up every day at 4:00 am just to get ready for a long commute. Last January, I moved closer to work. Since then, I've been trying to wake up at 5:00 am (after 7 hours of sleep) so I can do some workout, take a shower, get dressed and read a few pages of any philosophical book before I leave home. BUT, almost every night I end up waking up at 3:00 am. And then I can get back to a deep or restorative sleep. I just say in this soporific limbo between sleep and awake. I don't know if I should take it as an unhealthy sign for something else (am I being hunted by demons?!) or if I should take it as a sign of the force of habit that I still try to wake up at 4:00 am like I used to. 

 

Halp?

 

If what you wrote is right, and you mean that you can get back to sleep, it's really common to wake up about 4 hours into your night.  Go read up on biphasic sleep on Wikipedia, and you'll see that up until the Industrial Revolution, waking up half-way through the night was so common that people had names for each half of the night and common activities midway through.  This is what people naturally do.

 

If that was a typo for you can't get back to sleep, possibly habit.  Sometimes 15 minutes of a really soft podcast can help you drift off by helping the mind stop working.  Are you tired when you get up, or during the day?

 

Almost certainly not demons.

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23 hours ago, sarakingdom said:

 

If what you wrote is right, and you mean that you can get back to sleep, it's really common to wake up about 4 hours into your night.  Go read up on biphasic sleep on Wikipedia, and you'll see that up until the Industrial Revolution, waking up half-way through the night was so common that people had names for each half of the night and common activities midway through.  This is what people naturally do.

 

Oh, that is so Victorian! I love it!

 

I can get back to sleep, but it's never a deep sleep. I'm aware of being awake but I don't open my eyes, I just the clock to see if I can still stay in bed and sleep some more for short spaces of time (one hour or three quarters of one) and usually feel that I could go back to a deep sleep state if I didn't have to get up to work in a few hours/minutes.

 

So, I'll just find something to go along with my new non sleeping gothic habit and stop worrying about it.

 

 

Are you sure it's not demons? because I saw it in a movie that the demons always wake up at 3:00 am because that's the opposite of the hour Christ died... so it gotta be true, right?

 

 

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It wouldn't be the first time people got their theology from the media.

 

Also, I'm sure that if you manage to loosen up and relax some that this will iron out in time. Maybe.

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1 hour ago, The Shogun said:

Oh, that is so Victorian! I love it!

 

I know, right?  I instantly felt less anxious about waking up in the middle of the night.  If it's good enough for the 17th century, it's good enough for me.  I mean, they had names for it and everything!  Clearly that's not a "sleep problem" or whatever.

 

1 hour ago, The Shogun said:

I can get back to sleep, but it's never a deep sleep. I'm aware of being awake but I don't open my eyes, I just the clock to see if I can still stay in bed and sleep some more for short spaces of time (one hour or three quarters of one) and usually feel that I could go back to a deep sleep state if I didn't have to get up to work in a few hours/minutes.

 

It's probably keeping an eye on the clock that's the problem.  The anxiety about not being asleep or needing to be awake drives a lot of middle of the night insomnia.  Try covering the clock.  Or just going, "yeah, being awake four hours after I sleep is normal, so I'll just lie here and rest," and seriously don't worry about the sleep at all, just focus on getting rest and not worrying about things.  That's totally psychological, if you keep checking the clock.  Totally not demons.  Well, maybe clock demons.

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I definitly have to get to bed earlier next week. I'm trying to change my sleeping patterns in two weeks. At the moment I get up at 8. Soon I have to get up at six. And if I want to keep my morning routine 5:45 sounds more appropriate.

 

Any advice? I just don't think I'll be able to go to sleep at 10 pm.

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10 hours ago, Kishi said:

It wouldn't be the first time people got their theology from the media.

 

Also, I'm sure that if you manage to loosen up and relax some that this will iron out in time. Maybe.

 

10 hours ago, sarakingdom said:

 

I know, right?  I instantly felt less anxious about waking up in the middle of the night.  If it's good enough for the 17th century, it's good enough for me.  I mean, they had names for it and everything!  Clearly that's not a "sleep problem" or whatever.

 

 

It's probably keeping an eye on the clock that's the problem.  The anxiety about not being asleep or needing to be awake drives a lot of middle of the night insomnia.  Try covering the clock.  Or just going, "yeah, being awake four hours after I sleep is normal, so I'll just lie here and rest," and seriously don't worry about the sleep at all, just focus on getting rest and not worrying about things.  That's totally psychological, if you keep checking the clock.  Totally not demons.  Well, maybe clock demons.

 

WHAT? I can't sleep without my Pavlovian Device Overlord  <.<... But yeah, you're probably right. Maybe I should tackle the whole loosen up and relax for this challenge. 

 

I put my "The Works of Edgar Allan Poe" and my collection of H.P. Lovecraft's poetry work on my nightstand along with "Welcome to the Night Vale" and "Philosophize This!" Podcast on my Pavlovian Device for these sleepless victorian episodes. =D I'm going to put my phone on the nightstand to instead of under the pillow, BUT if tomorrow I'm late for work, you're teaching English to a bunch of Spanish-speaking Jewish Second Graders at 9:25 am.

 

1 hour ago, Luciana Valerosa Culming said:

I definitly have to get to bed earlier next week. I'm trying to change my sleeping patterns in two weeks. At the moment I get up at 8. Soon I have to get up at six. And if I want to keep my morning routine 5:45 sounds more appropriate.

 

Any advice? I just don't think I'll be able to go to sleep at 10 pm.

 

Thinks that have worked for me:

 

  • Have a routine to ease off into it and tell your body it's time to sleep. (I wash my teeth and face, write in my journal, meditate and then listen to some podcasts or audiobooks until I fall sleep).
  • No screen time, nor blue lights before bed. No rave parties.
  • The "“10-3-2-1-0" formula"
    • No more caffeine 10 hours before bed.
    • No more food or alcohol 3 hours before bed.
    • No more work 2 hours before bed.
    • No more screen time 1 hour before bed.
    • 0 times I hit the snooze button.
  • F.lux.
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@sarakingdom Hey! Look! I just read this article about what you mentioned. And I loved it. And I shared publicly so anyone can read it because it's freaking awesome. 

 

But it also made me think of what I am having a similar experience. Give the ehm... challenging situation of my country, I find that most days I got home before dark and since I work early, I go to bed early too. (Between 9 and 10 is early, right?). So maybe that's why.

 

But I don't have the "awareness" level to record my journal or to open my window naked yet. (I did put my dream journal in my nightstand and I sleep naked just in case).

 

Sorry for the TMI.

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15 hours ago, The Shogun said:

@sarakingdom Hey! Look! I just read this article about what you mentioned. And I loved it. And I shared publicly so anyone can read it because it's freaking awesome. 

 

But it also made me think of what I am having a similar experience. Give the ehm... challenging situation of my country, I find that most days I got home before dark and since I work early, I go to bed early too. (Between 9 and 10 is early, right?). So maybe that's why.

 

But I don't have the "awareness" level to record my journal or to open my window naked yet. (I did put my dream journal in my nightstand and I sleep naked just in case).

 

We should all aspire to the wisdom of Ben Franklin, my friend.  The occasionally dubious wisdom of Ben Franklin.

 

That's a great article, thanks for that!  I find it totally fascinating how something that was that universal an experience could disappear and become forgotten, to the point where people think they have a problem if that's how they sleep.

 

If you're getting enough rest, don't worry about it.  If you're not getting enough rest, see if not worrying about it helps you get back to sleep faster.  I kind of envy the early bedtime.

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I am surprised to hear that for someone is weird to wake up in the middle of the night. To me it has always been the normality, a pattern shared with everybody in the family.

It doesn't matter if I go to bed early or late. I noticed in the past that when it does not happen, usually it means that I am not sleeping enough, so it has become my benchmark.
 If I am not getting enough rest, I just don't wake up at 1am but I sleep until the alarm goes :)

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That wake up period between phases is where magic and adventure happen. Madeleine L'Engle taught me that.

 

Incidentally, the fact that I don't really experience it makes me feel like I miss out on something special. :-/

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Hey, anybody who's feeling like they want to gif-spam someone between 9:30 and, oh, 10:30 EST tonight, I could do with an influx of sleep-related gifs.  I'm trying to break a cycle of bad sleep choices that feed off my being too tired to make good sleep choices.  (Or you could spam me with your thoughts on sleep.  It's all about the sleep.  Did you know sleep has many mental and physical health benefits?  You can remind me.  In detail.  I will have totally forgotten.)  This is a sleep intervention.  Sometimes you just need to pull a buddy aside and go, "Look, we've all been sort of worried about you.  Have you ever thought about Insomnabulists Anonymous?"  This is that day.

 

(Somnambulism is the abnormal condition of walking around when you're asleep.  Insomnabulism is the abnormal condition of walking around when you should be asleep, but aren't.)

 

On this theme, the best sleep gif ever created:

 

tumblr_inline_moimidVqeb1qz4rgp.gif

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Hey, anybody who's feeling like they want to gif-spam someone between 9:30 and, oh, 10:30 EST tonight, I could do with an influx of sleep-related gifs.  I'm trying to break a cycle of bad sleep choices that feed off my being too tired to make good sleep choices.  (Or you could spam me with your thoughts on sleep.  It's all about the sleep.  Did you know sleep has many mental and physical health benefits?  You can remind me.  In detail.  I will have totally forgotten.)  This is a sleep intervention.  Sometimes you just need to pull a buddy aside and go, "Look, we've all been sort of worried about you.  Have you ever thought about Insomnabulists Anonymous?"  This is that day.

 

(Somnambulism is the abnormal condition of walking around when you're asleep.  Insomnabulism is the abnormal condition of walking around when you should be asleep, but aren't.)

 

I'm a) horrible at checking in on threads this past week, and B - at a loss on gifs.  However a special Igor quote for sleeping-

" He's not woken up at all?" said William. 

"No.  I look in on him every fifteen minutes or tho.  It can be like that.  Sometimeth the body just says: thleep."

"I heard he hardly ever sleeps," said William.

"Maybe he's taking the opportunity."

 

Hope you got a good crack at the insomnabulism.

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I'm a) horrible at checking in on threads this past week, and B - at a loss on gifs.  However a special Igor quote for sleeping-

" He's not woken up at all?" said William. 

"No.  I look in on him every fifteen minutes or tho.  It can be like that.  Sometimeth the body just says: thleep."

"I heard he hardly ever sleeps," said William.

"Maybe he's taking the opportunity."

 

Hope you got a good crack at the insomnabulism.

 

That is an excellent book, and an excellent quote.  Although, frankly, I'm surprised the cells were comfortable enough for that amount of sleep.

 

You know, maybe I'll take a stab at preventing insomnabulism tonight, and go watch a martial arts documentary in bed.  That's a productive use of my time, right?

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That is an excellent book, and an excellent quote.  Although, frankly, I'm surprised the cells were comfortable enough for that amount of sleep.

 

You know, maybe I'll take a stab at preventing insomnabulism tonight, and go watch a martial arts documentary in bed.  That's a productive use of my time, right?

Well...will it help you get to sleep, or will you get interested and stay awake?  If it makes your martial arts better, then of course it's a good use of your time. :)

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Has anybody any advice for sleeping when it's quite warm? I live in a five story building under the roof. In the summer it gets quite warm in our flat. In Juli it even tends to effect my sleep a bit(for about three weeks). Normaly i just suffer through it. But maybe anyone here has any tipps. Sleeping else where is not really an option.

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16 minutes ago, Chen Wangting said:

Has anybody any advice for sleeping when it's quite warm? I live in a five story building under the roof. In the summer it gets quite warm in our flat. In Juli it even tends to effect my sleep a bit(for about three weeks). Normaly i just suffer through it. But maybe anyone here has any tipps. Sleeping else where is not really an option.

 

Airflow helps a lot.  Especially if you can get window fans to vent the hot air out during the day and bring in the colder air at night.

 

When that's not enough (or if you don't have those), ice packs.  Anything that won't leak and is reusable, and the bigger the better, if you want it to last overnight.  They can cool your body temp down enough to be comfortable.

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Believe it or not, cold showers help with that too, at least toward the beginning of the night. And no, it's not just my preoccupation with cold showers talking; they actually do work.

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Hello, my name is Sara, and I'm an insomnoholic.

 

I gave myself a special holiday stay-up-late-to-watch-TV-and-drink-tea indulgence, and ended up starting a (very useful!) job that ended up with me going to bed at 5am.  (By which I mean nearly 6am.)  This means that I absolutely cannot trust myself to stay up late.  Anything past midnight is a serious ADHD-symptom risk, which I know, but don't always enforce.  (I can, however, go to bed and watch TV.  That doesn't trigger the same work-till-dawn impulse, and anything I can do to lure myself to bed is worthwhile.  But when it comes to post-midnight verticality, like the Überwald League of Temperance, my motto must be "Not von drop!"

 

shs0379a.gif

 

I need to become a black-ribboner.  It seems appropriate for midnight, and also the black-ribboners have explicitly given up all that "zee children off der night" business.  Like those going B-total, I need to resist my urges with cocoa and wholesome group singalongs about how I no longer crave zer B-vord, my vord yes!  (The cocoa, at least, seems useful for sleep.  Songs about no longer vanting to suck blood, not so much.  But you can't mess with tradition.  That much Discworld has taught me.)

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On 9/5/2016 at 1:56 PM, sarakingdom said:

Hello, my name is Sara, and I'm an insomnoholic.

 

I need to become a black-ribboner.  It seems appropriate for midnight, and also the black-ribboners have explicitly given up all that "zee children off der night" business.  Like those going B-total, I need to resist my urges with cocoa and wholesome group singalongs about how I no longer crave zer B-vord, my vord yes!  (The cocoa, at least, seems useful for sleep.  Songs about no longer vanting to suck blood, not so much.  But you can't mess with tradition.  That much Discworld has taught me.)

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I imagine that hearty singing would be great for releasing tension and clearing foul air from the body. It would also impress (intimidate?) your neighbors into silence, leading to better sleep. 

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The Ankh-Monkpork League of Temperance is going to become a thing, if I can find vun more person who vants to go v-total and join the black ribboners next challenge. If it runs, I have promised to do the whole challenge in the style of a Discworld vampire, and I vill run der Temperance League meetings. 

 

So if you vant to be abstainink from the V-word (vakefulness) and put all der old-fashioned children off der night business behind you, there vill be regular meetings at der town hall, und Chris vants a harmonium for der singalongs, und, you know, maybe der vill be a raffle, and of course cocoa.

 

 

(For those who want to do a sleep component of their challenge and join in but haven't read Discworld, feel free to do so anyway.  If you want to catch the references, there's only one book you need to get sufficiently up to speed for this challenge: The Truth, by Terry Pratchett, and also this very vague, truly minor reference to a thing you learn in an earlier book:

 

Spoiler

William is wrong about who the werewolf is.

 

If you're really ambitious, then go for Guards! Guards!, Men at Arms, and The Truth.  But three books by next challenge is only for the truly dedicated.)

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2 minutes ago, Lou_be_Lou said:

They are very good books though!  Just saying.  Butz zey kept me avake, Bekause I hadz to know vat happened nexkt...... Vich deveats ze purpose! Ja?

 

They are very good books.  And, in truth, we don't care if people stay up reading all night before the challenge starts.  Not our jurisdiction.  *whistles innocently*

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