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theodinspire

The Courtyard (Monks' General Chat)

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Oh, also, @RisenPhoenix, you'd love this: when sensei and I were judo'ing each other last Wednesday, he broke out wristlocks on me. We didn't do 'em at speed, and they felt way more like chin na drills from kung fu, but you know, ideas and such being common across arts.

 

I don't suppose you guys have any drills that would scratch my pedagogical itch, would you?

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On 7/23/2016 at 9:25 PM, Kishi said:

Oh, also, @RisenPhoenix, you'd love this: when sensei and I were judo'ing each other last Wednesday, he broke out wristlocks on me. We didn't do 'em at speed, and they felt way more like chin na drills from kung fu, but you know, ideas and such being common across arts.

 

I don't suppose you guys have any drills that would scratch my pedagogical itch, would you?

 

I've been thinking on this one.  Honestly I can't think of any drills we perform, because, well, wrist locks are just a thing that you need to do repeatedly to understand, because everyone's joint anatomy is the-same-but-different.  And really it's less the joint and more the arm's and lever lengths.

 

That said there are stretches we do regularly, but that's not quite what you're looking for.  And really, just performing and having wrist locks performed on you is the way to go.  Getting them performed on you is one of those weird, martial artist stereotypes of "Suffer some pain so you can later ignore it" type deals.

 

Though @Mistr may have some ideas, since she teaches an all.

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3 hours ago, RisenPhoenix said:

I've been thinking on this one.  Honestly I can't think of any drills we perform, because, well, wrist locks are just a thing that you need to do repeatedly to understand, because everyone's joint anatomy is the-same-but-different.  And really it's less the joint and more the arm's and lever lengths.

 

That said there are stretches we do regularly, but that's not quite what you're looking for.  And really, just performing and having wrist locks performed on you is the way to go.  Getting them performed on you is one of those weird, martial artist stereotypes of "Suffer some pain so you can later ignore it" type deals.

 

RP is right about using leverage more than the joint. Any move that depends on pain for control assumes that your attacker is feeling pain. That is a poor assumption in many cases. He might be drunk or wearing leather cuffs that protect the wrists. All the stretching and practice trains you how to protect your own wrists from being broken.

 

My understanding of aikido wrist locks is that the wrist is the contact point for taking slack out of the arm. Once the slack is removed, you can move the attacker's shoulder and take his balance. Pain compliance just makes it happen faster.

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On July 20, 2016 at 3:38 AM, DarK_RaideR said:

In general, I'd say I'm more attracted by the athletic/competitive nature of things like MT, BJJ and MMA in general as opposed to the more flowery/philosophical take on eastern martial arts or the technical approach of doing kata on one's own.

 

Agreed. Same thing with dancing vs fighting oriented capoeira and even outside martial arts (meditative vs flexy stretchy vs power yoga for example). What I'm saying is that KM is about training, sparring and taking exams; unless you actually need to use it in a real life scenario, there's not much actual fight in it. Much like @neomattlac, I'm not a big fan of pulling my punches. The MT dojo has a ring inside and its athletes compete in the occasional bout. Although I'm not aiming for that, it's more me, y'know? Speaking of which...

 

Crossfit has been that for me (I'm a Ranger at heart). I'd argue that the competitive atmosphere of a box and my experience from CF events has trickled down into my approach, as displayed in the previous paragraph :D

 

Hard sparring is fun. It's like competitively doing a WOD at your box without really signing up for a local competition. The martial arts with actual sparring and competitions, even if it's point-based, do apply well to the empirical CrossFitter mindset. Arts that are marketed as "self-defense" or just straight out martial arts are more akin to the specialists and fringe athletes--the best example I can think of would be that guy at the box concentrating [maybe a bit too much on] on gymnastic skills. He's probably not going to be competing, and that Front Lever/Iron Cross may have some carryover in his general fitness, but it probably isn't going to cut his Fran time as much as working the timing of his butterfly pull-ups would; he's doing it for the sake of the art.

 

My issue with the whole "self-defense" thing is that it's always associated with face and cock-punching, usually to the exclusion of everything else. Instead of being multi-dimentional, many people are predominantly concerned with being an action movie star. It's not that uncommon to see that 350-pound fat guy who thinks he's ready for the zombies because he can put two rounds center-mass on a target 20 yards away in a second, but can't climb a flight of stairs without having a heart attack. There are people who carry every day, round in the chamber, extra magazine accessible, and a $200 Benchmade knife as a backup weapon to "protect their family," but won't be bothered to carry a first-aid kit. Or a  guy with an AR in his house but no fire extinguisher. Personally I shoot because I enjoy it, I train in BJJ because I enjoy it. Maybe it will be of use someday, maybe it won't. I'm just not under the illusion that it's the best use of my time from a self-defense standpoint. (I haven't even re-certified on my first-aid yet--I won't know how to perform CPR off the top of my head, but I know how to do a Gogo Plata submission.) There's nothing wrong with training to be more prepared, I just wish folks realized that real self-defense isn't limited to killing/maiming people. Hell, if being more physically fit is part of someone's defensive plan and they train that by going to CrossFit three days a week, that may be a better long-term self-defense plan than learning some moves to do when someone grabs your wrist a certain way. I believe most people would benefit from taking courses like basic first-aid/trauma, defensive driving, or NRA's Refuse To Be A Victim instead of trying to be John Wick from a practical standpoint. But if it's for fun, hell yeah, everyone should go for it.

 

On July 23, 2016 at 9:20 PM, Kishi said:

Well, and you know, if that's the case, you might want to check whether any of the Boxes where you are have any martial affiliate schools. It's an arrangement I've seen more than once. But then again, if you got a place right there that just makes you go yes, then, well. That's kinda where you have to go, right?

 

I do think some boxes have a CrossFit Striking Trainer or a CrossFit Defense Trainer (which I believe uses the SPEAR system). I have even been to two with a separate BJJ section.

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7 hours ago, Machete said:

My issue with the whole "self-defense" thing is that...

I agree. Personally, I train because I enjoy the art, I enjoy feeling my body move and my control, and because I have always felt a duty to protect others.

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Gotta thank @Machete for that response and the COCKPUNCHER! video. Quite an accurate description of what I make of KM.

 

I get your point on martial arts and self defense, but maybe mine came across wrong. First of all, let's all agree that people should train according to whatever excites them. Applying this to myself, I said that "I'm more attracted by the athletic/competitive nature of things like MT, BJJ and MMA in general as opposed to the more flowery/philosophical take on eastern martial arts or the technical approach of doing kata on one's own." Hence the preference to try out the MT dojo next to my home instead of taking KM classes. By the way, all CF boxes I've found over here that integrate anything Monk-like involve Krav Maga lessons on the side.

 

I agree on your criticism of overly specialized "self defence" and your expanded, multi-dimensional definition (Ranger alert!). That said, I personally do not have the safety concerns that would lead me to take self defense classes or buy a gun (if I were in the good ole U.S. of A, at least) neither do I look at Muay Thai as a means to be a good fighter nor win competitions or street fights. To me, it just feels like a fun, challenging way to work out. It involves contact and people physically confronting each other, as opposed to crossfit's solo approach and parallel racing for reps or time, while still maintaining an adequate level of competition.

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to dive into those blog posts of yours. Never really paid attention to your signature besides the links to challenges. My bad, off to fix it :D

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On 7/28/2016 at 3:45 AM, DarK_RaideR said:

Gotta thank @Machete for that response and the COCKPUNCHER! video. Quite an accurate description of what I make of KM.

 

I get your point on martial arts and self defense, but maybe mine came across wrong. First of all, let's all agree that people should train according to whatever excites them. Applying this to myself, I said that "I'm more attracted by the athletic/competitive nature of things like MT, BJJ and MMA in general as opposed to the more flowery/philosophical take on eastern martial arts or the technical approach of doing kata on one's own." Hence the preference to try out the MT dojo next to my home instead of taking KM classes. By the way, all CF boxes I've found over here that integrate anything Monk-like involve Krav Maga lessons on the side.

 

I agree on your criticism of overly specialized "self defence" and your expanded, multi-dimensional definition (Ranger alert!). That said, I personally do not have the safety concerns that would lead me to take self defense classes or buy a gun (if I were in the good ole U.S. of A, at least) neither do I look at Muay Thai as a means to be a good fighter nor win competitions or street fights. To me, it just feels like a fun, challenging way to work out. It involves contact and people physically confronting each other, as opposed to crossfit's solo approach and parallel racing for reps or time, while still maintaining an adequate level of competition.

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to dive into those blog posts of yours. Never really paid attention to your signature besides the links to challenges. My bad, off to fix it :D

 

Thanks. Haha.

 

Yeah, I [think I] pretty much got you. I tend to go into long-winded tangents a lot (that's why I started the blog, so I don't "talk people's ears off" in forums.

 

It may be my anxiety, but I just don't believe that any amount of training is going to turn me into Liam Neeson from "Taken" or Jason Bourne. A lot of people don't seem to share this belief. Sometimes I wish I had their confidence.

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17 hours ago, Machete said:

Yeah, I [think I] pretty much got you. I tend to go into long-winded tangents a lot (that's why I started the blog, so I don't "talk people's ears off" in forums.

 

It may be my anxiety, but I just don't believe that any amount of training is going to turn me into Liam Neeson from "Taken" or Jason Bourne. A lot of people don't seem to share this belief. Sometimes I wish I had their confidence.

I don't mind long-winded tangents when they're on a topic I'm interested in. Your blog posts were a delightful read, especially "Fitness:Hard to sell" (totally agree) and lessons learned from Final Fantasy.

 

Neeson in "Taken", Bourne, John Wick and everyone else are characters in action movies, not actual people. I admire your realism, as I admire people's hopes of reaching such levels. At least it keeps them inspired and motivated I guess, but doesn't take anything away from you. Saw a video of you the other day doing strict ring muscle ups while wearing a friggin weight vest. Give yourself some credit, brother

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On 8/3/2016 at 2:37 AM, DarK_RaideR said:

I don't mind long-winded tangents when they're on a topic I'm interested in. Your blog posts were a delightful read, especially "Fitness:Hard to sell" (totally agree) and lessons learned from Final Fantasy.

 

Neeson in "Taken", Bourne, John Wick and everyone else are characters in action movies, not actual people. I admire your realism, as I admire people's hopes of reaching such levels. At least it keeps them inspired and motivated I guess, but doesn't take anything away from you. Saw a video of you the other day doing strict ring muscle ups while wearing a friggin weight vest. Give yourself some credit, brother

 

Thank you, sir. You're too kind. I've since deleted Final Fantasy Tactics from my phone when I realized how much it was interfering with my day-to-day life. Haha

 

Ah, the Instagrams. I try to put in some basic useful stuff in there, but more often than not I fall victim to having to post something cool, because Instagram.

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I suppose I should clarify: the strengths you develop in rapier are very lopsided. One leg gets really good at pushing and the other gets really good at absorbing landings. The arm and back opposite of the pushing leg gets pretty strong while not much happens with the other arm. Also you gotta watch your knees so that they don't explode. It is a silly fighting system, and only good for back alley duels.

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I suppose I should clarify: the strengths you develop in rapier are very lopsided. One leg gets really good at pushing and the other gets really good at absorbing landings. The arm and back opposite of the pushing leg gets pretty strong while not much happens with the other arm. Also you gotta watch your knees so that they don't explode.

You run into similar issues in Military Saber. I've been thinking about doubling my drills and practicing half right-handed and half left-handed but I need to work on getting a steadier workout schedule first.

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