Pro Wrestling/'Rasslin/Lucha Libre/Puroresu

[Garth]

Urgh, they really have derailed all the positive momentum they had with Punk.

In other news, Mark Henry as world champion. I really like the push he's been given the last few months, and he's probably having the best run of his career.

It's not often we get monster heels in WWE that can actually destroy people to win and not have to cheat to win, so it's novel in that respect.

[Hannibal]

And not only did he go over clean, but he did it over Randy Orton! That never happens! I'm glad he's getting a run. After all the crap he's had to go through over the years, it's nice that he's getting a reward run at the top. And the fact that it seems to mean something is even better.

But why, oh why, did they already take the belt off of Del Rio? He's had it for like a month, and now Cena's champ again and ADR is probably on his way back to the mid-card. Hopefully they work something out & he gets over.

[Garth]

Urgh, I know. So pissed about the Del Rio loss. I just watched it for the first time now, and the finish was just so anticlimactic and Del Rio just wasn't really made to look like he could win and nor did Cena look like he was ever in any real danger of losing.

I pretty much lose interest in Raw every time Cena is on top as champion. It's pretty much always the least interesting option that they can go with as champion at the moment. Also, with the main event of HIAC being a three way of Del Rio/Punk/Cena there was just no need to cut Del Rio off at the knees and put the title on Cena. It derails all of his momentum and makes him look not at that level.

I've also just started watching this years G1 Climax, which I've never done before. It's looking interesting and I have no idea of any of the results. Trying to get into NJPW at the moment and thought it might be good a place as any to drop in.

[Hannibal]

And Del Rio was made to look like a complete jabronie by having him tap out in the middle of the ring. Suck.

Yeah, absolutely! A great place to start! The G1 is often a good tournament, and I hear this year's was no different. I haven't seen it yet, but do know the results. How far into it are you? How familiar with the talent are you?

[Hannibal]

On a somewhat tangential note, do you know what frustrates me? The total under-representation of lucha libre on these here internets. This stuff's gold, it's gold! If you haven't seen it, or don't watch it, I highly recommend giving it a shot. So much fun! It's vastly different from North American or Japanese wrestling, but I find that difference really refreshing. A breath of fresh air.

It seems like every fall I'll find a source to watch it, enjoy every second of it, then that source will dry up around new year, and I'll miss out on watching everything that happens from January to September, then have to re-familiarize myself with everything again in the fall. I forget who's who, especially with the masks, and I forget exactly what the rules are in CMLL. The last few weeks I've been watching CMLL and luckily found a place to watch Triple A this past weekend.

The first thing that tends to come to mind when talking about lucha is small, agile, flippy dudes, like Rey Mysterio, Mystico/Sin Cara, or Juventude Guerrera. Yeah, the young flippy guys are fun, but the real draw for me is the stocky, middle-aged rudos. Especially the ones still in their masks. The mask really adds something, IMO. I am so thoroughly entertained by these guys. The ones who are still top draws at that age have managed to master the craft, ooze charisma despite having their faces covered, make the technicos look good, and make any match 1000 times better. For great examples look up Silver King, a new favorite of mine Mr. Niebla, or Dr. Wagner Jr. (my avatar pic), who is technically a technico now, but when I first caught on to him a couple years back he was a rudo.

I wish more people were into lucha, so I could find it online more easily.

[Garth]

So, who's excited about Rock vs. CM Punk at the Rumble? Just me? 

[Guest Snake McClain]

Rock/punk can be really good. I missed the last raw but id heard this was coming. Personally I think punk needs to heat the rock clean. The rock doesn't need the push and imagine the smack talk wed get from punk if he wins? Should be good no matter the result.

Unrelated (sort of): I've returned to pro wrestling training. New focus and priorities. Should he able to give this a real shot. Though I don't plan to make a career out of it.

[Garth]

Yeah, I'd be pretty happy with either result to be honest. Would do a lot for Punk if he won though. The talk leading up to the match should be glorious. 

 

I've been trying to work out what the 'Mania card will be this year. 

 

In my ideal world it would be the following as the top matches: 

 

The Rock© vs Brock Lesnar

 

CM Punk vs. The Undertaker

 

John Cena vs. Sheamus 

 

Dolph Ziggler © vs. Daniel Bryan

 

Ryback vs. Big Show

 

 

That's awesome that you've gone back to training. How's it all coming along so far?

[KAllen]

I think this thread has turned into the CMPunk worship thread.  Or the wwe worship thread. 

[Garth]

You say that like it's a bad thing! CM Punk & WWE itself have churned out some excellent stuff over the last 12 months. That's not to say that either of them have faultless records, but the good stuff has been really good. 

 

I still love good indy stuff, but haven't watched TNA or ROH in as long as I can remember. 

 

Speaking of good indy stuff, a promotion runs shows now literally 100ft from my house at a local community centre. It's the best. One of the top guys wrestled in Chikara's YLC in 2011. I've met him a few times, and he's a good dude.  

[Guest Snake McClain]

cm punk is pretty great. but he is also kind of a douche in real life.

 

I heard for a while the idea was punk/ziggler but that's out now which is sad because that would have been an incredible match.

 

but ziggler / bryan is probably better in a lot of ways.

 

Training is good. Its just like before. easier now though because i'm in a ton better shape and the class is half the size this year. so i can get a lot more hands on time with the instructor and more ring time. its nice.

[KAllen]

Couldn't tell ya about Punk, except I know who he is, meaning I've heard of him.  I don't watch that wwe crap. 

 

I watch TNA, and used to watch AAA until Galavision replaced it w/ that cmll crap.

 

I was hoping that this thread would have been more "well rounded".

[Garth]

KAllen:

 

You're missing out on some really good matches then by not watching. Like I said, it's not perfect but there's been some excellent stuff over the last year. What is it that you don't like about WWE? 

 

I don't watch TNA, I've found it too hard to get through an episode of Impact and they don't really have many guys on their roster that I'm interested in anymore. Probably stopped watching with any consistency in about 2008. 

 

They have the odd guy on the roster I really like though, and will ocassionally try and find matches online. Austin Aries/James Storm/Samoa Joe are probably my favourites. Have you ever seen Austin Aries vs Samoa Joe for the ROH title? Damn, that was one hell of a match. Still get goosebumps when I revisit it. ROH between about 2004-2006 was so great. 

 

If you want it to be more 'well rounded' take it in that direction that would interest you. There was a lot more varied discussion in here previously, but because of the migration of the board about 100 posts have disappeared. 

Other than TNA do you keep up with any other indies? I try and follow Chikara as best I can, and I watch Shimmer when I get the chance. I wish I had time to watch all the wrestling I wanted, but there's not enough hours in the day. 

 

Snake:

Yeah, he can be as big a douche as he likes in real life, so long as he's entertaining on TV I couldn't care less. 

 

Punk/Ziggler did have a couple of matches about this time last year I think and they were pretty damn good. 

 

I think a face Daniel Bryan vs. Ziggler could be fantastic and a real show stealer at Mania. 

 

I'm glad that training is better this go around. What's the best thing you've learnt so far? 

[Guest Snake McClain]

i agree with garth. wwe has had some good matches and interesting stories. theyve had crappy ones too. but if you watch the right guys its been wrestling gold as of late.

[KAllen]

wwe is probably the worst thing I've seen in wrestling, and my history w/ wrestling goes back to the 70s watching my hometown's show, Mid-South Championship Wrestling.  Vince knows only how to make $ and is totally wasting talent.  I force myself to watch some of it once in a blue moon, and my step-sons kinda watch it.  I mean, look how he's ruined Mysterio.  Totally awesome wrestler, and they waste his talent.  Another point, look at what he did to ECW!!!  

 

If it wasn't for TNA, I would have quite watching wrestling when Vince bought WCW and nearly destroyed pro-wrestling in the US.  I hate Vince so much, that if I lived in CT, I wouldn't have voted for his wife for Senate, and I NEVER vote for Dems.

 

AAA is one of my favs, but for some reason, it's not on the Mexican stations. Used to be on Galavision, but now all I can get is CMLL, and that is like watching wwe, or pulling teeth w/ vice grips. W/out speaking Spanish, I could tell you the storylines, who's good/bad/feuding, man AAA is awesome. 

[spezzy]

There was a lot more varied discussion in here previously, but because of the migration of the board about 100 posts have disappeared.

Reporting these things isn't a bad idea so I know about them and can try to figure out what happened

(If this post seems brief or anything like that it's because I'm using my phone and don't want to type a lot )

[Guest Snake McClain]

The wwe product although not the best around has improved quite a bit. They don't change what they're doing because they simply do not have to. No one is forcing their product to improve. We vote with our dollar. And right now the wwe is way ahead in the polls. I prefer new japan or ring of honor over everything else...except maybe chikara. But the truth is none of them have a chance against the wwe. Complain if you like but the truth is they do have good matches if the right guys are working it. They are signing some serious talent and that talent is improving match quality.

Spezzy, you don't even like wrestling. Get out of here.

[Garth]

Reporting these things isn't a bad idea so I know about them and can try to figure out what happened (If this post seems brief or anything like that it's because I'm using my phone and don't want to type a lot )

 

I didn't even think to, just figured it was to be expected from the migration. If I notice anything else, will definitely make it known.

 

 

 

The wwe product although not the best around has improved quite a bit. They don't change what they're doing because they simply do not have to. No one is forcing their product to improve. We vote with our dollar. And right now the wwe is way ahead in the polls. I prefer new japan or ring of honor over everything else...except maybe chikara. But the truth is none of them have a chance against the wwe. Complain if you like but the truth is they do have good matches if the right guys are working it. They are signing some serious talent and that talent is improving match quality.

 

I'm excited to see how far they can go with Cesaro. Loved him in his Claudio days, and think he has plenty to offer. Would love to see him up again Daniel Bryan eventually.

 

Looking forward to Chris Hero's eventual debut as well. Also, how good are the Shield? Expecting big things from Dean Ambrose. 

 

In TNA related stuff, interesting move on their part to go to 4 live PPVs a year, and tape the rest ahead of time. 

 

I've seen the results of the first couple of taped ones and I'm not convinced. On the plus side, it gives them ages to plan and build towards the 4 live PPVs a year now which could be really helpful in putting on great shows. 

I remember the early days of TNA monthly PPVs and more or less every match had the possibility of stealing the show. Hopefully it'll be like that again. 

[Guest Snake McClain]

Alright wrestling fans i have a wrestling question.

 

So right now my ring name is Snake McClain. But i'm considering making a change. I'm thinking either Wolf McClain or Abraham Wolf. Here's the reason...

 

Snake McClain sounds like a war hero type bad ass military guy. However Wolf McClain or Abraham Wolf...is more like a super villain. sophisticated despot type. Which I like a ton....

 

Snake McClain's original angle was supposed to be he is a war hero type guy and now is a wrestling mercenary for hire. i can do the same thing with wolf buuuuuut i can lose the war hero bit and be a bit more of a dark super villain type guy.

 

thoughts?

[Garth]

I'm with Athena on this one, not so sure about the ones you suggested.

 

I sat and had a think of an alternative; what do you think of Sterling Wolf(e)?

 

Sorry, don't know much about lucha I'm afraid. Certainly not enough to answer your question anyway. I hope someone can. 

[Guest Snake McClain]

Abraham Wolf makes me think of a) Twilight, and b.)  Abraham Lincoln, Vampire Hunter (y'know, wolf, vampire...). It sounds almost cutesy, like you've got a pet wolf you like to call Abraham. I like Wolf McClain much better. Wolf as a first name brings to my mind Pulp Fiction's Wolf. Much more badass. (Though he was Mr. Wolf, so technically Wolf works as a good last name... I just don't like it with paired with Abraham.)

 

On the whole though, I think Snake McClain has a better ring to it. Rolls off the tongue nicely. It does sound Cobra-esque, and ex-military, so if that's not what you're going for, a change might be in order.

 

I have a lucha libre question! Does anyone know how American wrestlers go, popularity wise, in lucha libre? When they do well, do they do OK as technicos, or only as rudos?

 

 

I'm with Athena on this one, not so sure about the ones you suggested.

 

I sat and had a think of an alternative; what do you think of Sterling Wolf(e)?

 

Sorry, don't know much about lucha I'm afraid. Certainly not enough to answer your question anyway. I hope someone can. 

 

 

I agree that Abraham Wolf doesn't sound as good. I like Wolf McClain a lot. about as equally as Snake McClain. If I go with Snake McClain the character will most certainly be ex military/hero type guy. I even have tights planned out to be very g.i. joe like. So that is EXACTLY what I was going for. I just am not sure if that's what I still want to do.

 

Wolf McClain just sounds scarier to me. So if i ever went heel I know it would have a bit of intensity in it. and let's think of a wolf for a moment. A wolf from the wild, sure he can be in captivity and maybe get along, but if you watch one and it's eyes you know he's never really "There" and you never know what he's really up to. What's on his mind? What's his next move? A snake is just bad news, but a wolf is cunning.

 

I think i might go for wolf mcclain but i'm still testing the market so to speak.

 

 

Sadly i don't know much about lucha except that when i watch it i like it quite a bit.  I'll ask some of my friends and try to grab some info about how americans go over there. ANd if you like LUCHA then you should watch Chikara. It is a mix of Lucha and super indie stuff. 

[KAllen]

I have a lucha libre question! Does anyone know how American wrestlers go, popularity wise, in lucha libre? When they do well, do they do OK as technicos, or only as rudos?

 

 

AAA has several Non-Mexican wrestlers.  Mainly Japanese & Americans, and a few Puerto Ricanos.  Lots of times they use them as bad guys, but some creep over to the technicos.  El Mesias(he's PR) was a rudo for a long time, now I believe he's technico.  Jack Evans is a totally awesome wrestler, high flyer.  He was a bad guy, but last I saw he was a good guy.  X-Pac had a group called "DeGeneration Mex" they were technicos.  Konnan is Cuban and he's a bad guy(*note* My Mexican wife said that Mexicans don't really care for Cubans or PRs, they don't consider them true latinos....I won't tell you what she calls them)  Some of the "bricks" they use as big guys.  Kenzo Suzuki was a bad guy.  Hamada started as a female rudo, but wound up being a technico.  Angelina Love was in AAA for a brief stint, she was a rudo. 

[KAllen]

Snake...if you stick w/ Snake McClain, you should play the "Snake Plisken" role. 

 

What about Abraham McClain and pull a Scottish theme, wear a kilt and braveheart face paint. 

[Garth]

Speaking of names though, even though I'm an official and not a player I get a roller derby name. Settled on Garth Vader.

 

Also, speaking of Hamada; it sucks that she never really got to shine in TNA. I love her work. I went to a TNA house show over here one time and she answered an open challenge against Eric Young for the then Global title. Heck of a match.

[Guest Snake McClain]

Snake McClain is a combo of Snake Plisken and John McClain. It was one purpose.

 

I love snake plisken