New to NF but not new to Paleo

[Dave R.]

Hi, my name is Dave and I just signed up on this web site.  I discovered this site the other day but I have actually been eating Paleo for the past month with decent results (I think).  I also regularly lift weights with a fairly basic routine that includes bench, squat, deadlift, shoulder press, and rows.  I’ve been doing that for a while but I decided I wasn’t pleased with how I looked in the mirror so for the first time I went all in with better eating.  I am 5’6†and thirty one days ago I was 175.  Today I am 165.  I’m not really sure about my body fat percentage.  I purchased calipers last week but I’m not sure if I’m measuring properly.  It showed I was at 21% body fat.  It’s possible I guess but I was under the impression that at 21% one wouldn’t be able to see their abs without flexing.  I currently can see my abs without flexing though admittedly I do not see abs below my belly button.  I think the biggest change over the past month is that my visceral fat has been reduced.  Before my gut would stick out starting from my solar plexus and now it’s straight down when I look at myself from a profile view.  One of the other big changes, and this is more important to me, is that since I have changed eating Paleo I have far more energy and I am more alert which is important since I do software performance testing.  My clothes fit much better as well, especially the jeans which have stopped looking like they were painted on my body. 

 

Two surprises to me over this past month is that my progress in the gym has not been stalled.  In fact, the weight is still going up.  The other surprise to me is that I didn’t quit on Paleo.  I made a decision to do it and I never really looked back.

 

I’m on this site to make sure I’m on the right path and doing the right things.  I really want to be at 10% body fat for no other reason than to get there and if at all possible I’d like to be there at the end of the year.  Can anyone suggest pointers?  Do you (as the community) need more details to find out whether or not I’m on the right track.  I’m considering implementing intermittent fasting for this second month eating Paleo.  Is that a step in the right direction.

 

Any insight will be greatly appreciated.

[JPrev]

Some cheeky maths, that may or may not be good approximations of what to expect:

 

Assuming you currently weigh 165lbs and are at 21% body fat, that means you have 34.65 pounds of fat.  To get to 10% body fat, you'll need to lose ~17 of those pounds.

 

The general rule you'll find is you shouldn't aim to lose any more than 2lbs of fat per week.  If you follow that restriction, you'd lose 17 pounds of fat after about 9 weeks.  We have 11 weeks or so until January, so the math says your goal is possible!

 

But is it PRACTICAL.  Maybe.  The first thing to consider is it's easier to lose fat when you have more of it, and it'll get tougher the less you have.  Going from 21% to 16% will be easier than 16% to 11%.

 

It's all about creating a calorie deficit.  If you're burning more than you're taking in - either because you're training harder, eating less, or some combination of the two - you'll lose weight.  To make sure it's mostly fat you're losing and not muscle, you'll want to pay close attention to the quality of things you're eating.  Even so, the progress on your lifts will slow during a "cut" like this, and especially if you go too quickly, it'll tap out entirely before beginning to decline.

 

In general, you'll hear it's better to lose body fat slowly.  It's not necessarily unhealthy to lose more than 2lbs of fat per week, but you have to consider just how much effort that actually takes.  We're talking a big deficit!  If you're creating that deficit via eating less, then you're going to have to find ways to deal with your hunger and make sure you're still properly nourished - especially if you're trying to keep some muscle as well.  If you're going to create the deficit via working out harder, you'll have to be careful of injuries and illness from overtraining.  There are some very specific nutrition and training strategies for aggressive fat loss endeavors like this, but I haven't researched them much.

 

Is there a reason you want to hit the goal by the end of the year?  Are you happy with how much you've bulked up before you get started?  Do you have a sense for how many calories you're shooting for?

[Dave R.]

Some cheeky maths, that may or may not be good approximations of what to expect:

 

Assuming you currently weigh 165lbs and are at 21% body fat, that means you have 34.65 pounds of fat.  To get to 10% body fat, you'll need to lose ~17 of those pounds.

 

The general rule you'll find is you shouldn't aim to lose any more than 2lbs of fat per week.  If you follow that restriction, you'd lose 17 pounds of fat after about 9 weeks.  We have 11 weeks or so until January, so the math says your goal is possible!

 

But is it PRACTICAL.  Maybe.  The first thing to consider is it's easier to lose fat when you have more of it, and it'll get tougher the less you have.  Going from 21% to 16% will be easier than 16% to 11%.

 

It's all about creating a calorie deficit.  If you're burning more than you're taking in - either because you're training harder, eating less, or some combination of the two - you'll lose weight.  To make sure it's mostly fat you're losing and not muscle, you'll want to pay close attention to the quality of things you're eating.  Even so, the progress on your lifts will slow during a "cut" like this, and especially if you go too quickly, it'll tap out entirely before beginning to decline.

 

In general, you'll hear it's better to lose body fat slowly.  It's not necessarily unhealthy to lose more than 2lbs of fat per week, but you have to consider just how much effort that actually takes.  We're talking a big deficit!  If you're creating that deficit via eating less, then you're going to have to find ways to deal with your hunger and make sure you're still properly nourished - especially if you're trying to keep some muscle as well.  If you're going to create the deficit via working out harder, you'll have to be careful of injuries and illness from overtraining.  There are some very specific nutrition and training strategies for aggressive fat loss endeavors like this, but I haven't researched them much.

 

Is there a reason you want to hit the goal by the end of the year?  Are you happy with how much you've bulked up before you get started?  Do you have a sense for how many calories you're shooting for?

 

Thank you for the reply.  I think my biggest reason for challenging myself is, in all honesty, is the challenge itself.  After seeing the testimonial for “Saint†the way I figure is that most people are not genetic freaks of nature so if he could do it why not me?  I would not be defeated or sad if I couldn’t make that goal by the end of the year.  I suppose the number I picked is just arbitrary.  I would like to cut as much fat as possible to keep as much muscle as possible.  Essentially maximize my results.  I understand I can’t expect to gain size and cut fat at the same time.

 

I’ve never had a personal goal like this before.  Just out of curiosity let’s say my numbers in the gym start to decline.  Is it still beneficial to keep trying to lift heavy while maintaining a certain caloric deficit or at that point should I increase the calories?  Again, to be clear I eat Paleo and I’m very serious about what I eat so the quality of food isn’t a concern.

[JPrev]

It sounds like you're approaching this with a healthy mentality.  I'd ditch the thought of getting to such a low body fat % by January - if it happens, it happens, but if your REAL goal is just to challenge yourself to have a great phsyique, I say it's worth taking the time to go about it in a sustainable way.

 

Here's the flow people typically say to follow.  If you're new to lifting (month or less), then keep lifting without worrying much about food yet.  You need to build a foundation of strength before you think about eating surplus calories - otherwise, those excess calories will go more to fat than muscle.  Keep lifting until you reach a point where rapid improvement ceases.  This is usually anywhere between a couple and a few months.  Now you start eating at a surplus, and your lifts will continue to steadily improve.  Keep bulking until you're at the level of muscle mass you want, then switch to cutting.

 

I'd imagine you'd want to spend a couple months bulking, then a couple cutting.  You can repeat the cycle again and again if you like (bulk through the winters, cut leading to the summers), or you can find some sort of middle ground between the two that makes you happy and you decide to preserve.

 

  Is it still beneficial to keep trying to lift heavy while maintaining a certain caloric deficit or at that point should I increase the calories?

 

 

There are two ideas going on in this question.  First, in order to maintain as much muscle as you can while cutting, you'll want to preserve your lifting routine as closely as possible.  If you have to make adjustments (say, you begin to find you can't do as many reps as before) you should keep the intensity high (lift the same weight) but decrease the volume (aim for a rep or two less per set).  Don't be ashamed of decreasing the volume a bit.

 

Whether or not you increase the calories will depend on your goals.  Through the cut, you'll probably only want to lose about 1lb a week in order to preserve your muscle, so your total intake shouldn't be so severely slashed to begin with.  After the cut, you may decide to bulk again and go back and forth between the two in a cycle.

 

Finally, it's great if paleo is helping you think about your nutrition a little bit.  I'm personally not married to it, nor have I found it necessary for my goals.  So far, I'm not convinced that carbs are the vile enemy that so many paleo followers believe.

[Sythez]

Welcome to NF. Glad to have ya

 

Also, awesome job on your success so far! You've done amazingly

 

My only advice? Listen to your body. If you're feeling low energy, miserable, or finding things are getting worse and not better, rethink and adjust. Caloric deficits be damned some days, make sure you are getting the nutrition your body needs. Calories are not created equally, and as of such should not be treated that way.

Good luck with your goals, and look forward to hearing from ya!