All Things Discipline

[Vector]

Small Change is Poison turns into a different game after it becomes automatic:

 

"Small Change Is My Everything!"

 

This one is both easier and harder for most people. Easier mentally, harder physically.

 

You have decided to LOVE change. You want it. You are now not allowed to minimize the amount of change you will be given in any transaction. And you must carry your change all day in you pocket, bag or purse. Again, you aren't allowed to use credit or debit cards during this game for purchases made in person.

 

Simple. You buy something for $1.02, you get 98 cents for your purse or pocket! It's exciting! You've got change! You then buy something for $6.15, you got another 85 cents! So cool! This one can get really heavy! Cashier tries to use the free pennies pile to even things out? Stop them, gently! "Oh no, thank you but I really need the change!'. You can never give coins you have on you, period. At the end of each day, dump your coin-haul in a big-ass jar and commend yourself on a job well done. 

 

Continue until you are doing it automatically, then change back to "poison" mode. It will work better if you go back and forth at least once.

 

 

[I-Jo]

I am missing the point of these change games.

I see no advantage or dropping money in the ground which is littering.

And i see no reason why I should carry change with me-especially with no pockets or purse.

I understand the discipline of doing something just to do it. .. but seem illogical to me. Picking something that has a positive impact on my life would b be a better way to build habits. Making my bed everyday... putting shoes away. I must be missing something.

[Vector]

I am missing the point of these change games.

I see no advantage or dropping money in the ground which is littering.

And i see no reason why I should carry change with me-especially with no pockets or purse.

I understand the discipline of doing something just to do it. .. but seem illogical to me. Picking something that has a positive impact on my life would b be a better way to build habits. Making my bed everyday... putting shoes away. I must be missing something.

You actually hit all of the reasons why these exercises work. Illogical or meaningless actions are difficult to justify to the mind (although obviously people do it all the time, like Celiacs who eat wheat or people with lung disease who smoke) and thus on some level force the acceptance that you are doing (or not doing as the case may be) something entirely due to having made a conscious decision.

Logical pathways can obviously be used. The meaningless actions are strictly training, like lifting weights or jogging. They can be very useful to learn compliance and strengthen the will, as well as to expose the general irrationality of our habitual behaviors.

I dropped a quarter once in Dallas

It went rolling down the bluff

They arrested me for littering

They said I didn’t drop enough

They’ve got the cleanest cells in Texas

Even their jailbirds’ve got no soul

Wrap me up in Austin

Where at least when I’m locked up I feel at home

---Danny Schmidt

[cn3wton]

I understand the whole premise of the coin dropping thing.  But after I have started saving coin I realize how quickly it adds up.  And for me that extra cash is much needed (since part of it goes to pay for my gym membership). 

 

It would be interesting to find an alternative.

[Vector]

Sure, anything can work. Basic ambidextrous stuff is good, and easily adjusted. Just start doing x with you off hand...carrying stuff, brushing teeth, using keys in doorways, opening doors. Do it until it is natural, then switch. Although there are neural benefits to this approach it is still important to do it simply because you chose to do it. Don't justify your actions.

Other options I can think off offhand are endless, but...

If you have workout ADD, commit to a single workout for x period of time. Do not waver, and make sure you can do it. Bodyweight is good so you can't claim equipment issues.

Discard a food from your diet. Add it back in later.

Choose a random time to wake up. If you have to be up a 6:30, change that to 6:21. Then 6:15. Then 6:31.

If you have a regular walk or bike ride or drive, change it daily. Yes, it will be inefficient which has exactly nothing to do with what it helps with.

It helps if you can change things easily. So if you walk a different route, once that becomes normal, go back to a single route.

Most people who have played with these types of games find that "less important and less reasonable" work better. What is important is that you a) commit, and don't second guess. Anytime you find yourself asking "why am I doing this" your answer is "because I decided I would do this" or some personal version of that. None of this BS 'it's good for me' or 'it'll make me a better person'. Those are all secondary stories, justifications and rationalizations EVEN if they are true. Everything we do or do not do happens because we made a choice to to do it. This is critical to the process. You are what you do, and you do what you decide to do.

[I-Jo]

I agree with the doing things because it's a choice- but usually it's something for a reason that I have been choosing to NOT do.   The coins- meh- couldn't do it for a lot of reasons- one because dropping them is wasteful and littering and saving them is fiscally responsible (that shit adds up).

 

 

But I absolutely agree with the doing things simple for the purpose of doing it as a discipline issue.  THAT I can get on board with LOL

[dilettante]

I like that attitude. I'm doing this because I chose to. Good way to think, I'll try to apply this. Thanks. 

 

For me, self-discipline is such a challenge because I'm impatient. I know that the best way to make sustainable changes is gradually, I've got plenty of experience with trying to make changes that backs this up for me, yet I will get frustrated and want to make lots of changes at once, especially if I feel like I've been too lazy or sedentary or unhealthy recently. 

[Vector]

This is a very good blog post from Rory Miller who has a very fascinating past and is a major go to guy on the subject of violence, use of force, and related issues. This one deals in part with our subject:

http://chirontraining.blogspot.com/2013/04/thats-gotta-hurt.html

[Burizado]

That was a great article Vector!

 

I read it and was totally like "YEAH!"

 

Makes me think about that I need to start pushing my boundaries out more, and do things that don't "like" to do to make me a better/stronger person.

[Vector]

Glad you liked it, he's really good.

 

Part of another page of his called "The way of the guy who is actually there" is awesome, too. It's the second thing down on this page:

 

http://chirontraining.com/Site/Thoughts.html

 

It's another aspect most of us (myself definitely included) are pretty bad at...

 

 

 

[Wolverine]

I really like the idea of training the mind just like you would train a muscle.  Great thoughts, V.  Thanks for sharing!

[Vector]

I really like the idea of training the mind just like you would train a muscle.  Great thoughts, V.  Thanks for sharing!

I do think it's all the same...general adaptation syndrome and hormesis and all that jazz.

[terrormortus]

For discipline I have three methods which I fall back on. I didn't actually go out and think these up for the specific purpose of making myself do things, it just sort of happened.

 

First off their is Adult Brandon, I fucking hate that guy. Every time I want to do something stupid that will make me feel good right then (skip a workout, buy cookies, etc, etc) he pops up being all logical. "You know you shouldn't be doing that." You're gonna feel bad later." "You know if you wait till tomorrow such and such will happen and it will be better then doing this." And as a result I won't do what I was thinking about, or will feel bad about it, and eventually I just stop doing that stuff.

 

Second is just make something always available. I was starting to drink too much, spending too much money on it and it was effecting other areas of my life. So I started carrying around a flask of Jameson. Haven't touched it in the eight months its been in my pocket and my other drinking has reduced to a quarter of what it was. No idea how it works.

 

Finally I just make something so big it can never live up to my expectations. Like sweets, I gave them up recently and after debating ended up eating a couple of cookies. They were mediocre. Again, no idea how it works.

[Vector]

The Jameson is awesome! Great ideas. I can't use the first one however as Adult Vector is sometimes ruled by the Dark Side.

[Elder]

Ugh I dislike Responsible Jen, sometimes she can be a real bi..bi...bi...not a very nice person.  She puts the beat down on Unruly Jen most of the time.  It's the same thing with me, as soon as I go to make a not so good choice I start having a mental argument with myself about whether I should do it or not.

 

I always make things available too, but I make healthy things available and keep all the sugar and crap out of my place so I have no excuse to eat a bag of chips when I am lazy.

 

I still have to work on my workout discipline because Unruly Jen pops her head up far too often to sabotage me when I am on a roll.  I will be good for a few weeks, keeping a regular schedule, then one day I will be extra tired/pissed/fed-up/lazy after work and I will just plop my ass on the couch and not move.  I find telling myself out loud to "Just get the F' up and put on your shoes!" works great to mobilize me.

[BarefootViking]

My motivation for working out is remembering back to being so gassed (and not strong enough) that by the time I got the cargo net obstacle in the first Spartan Race I did, that I had to back down because I couldn't get my leg over without falling.  My arms were sooooo gone by then.

[The Mouse]

My dad and I were discussing this on the bus today, actually.

 

We're both really fortunate - we have a fair amount of self-discipline. Both of us can drop carbs easily (if we do eat it, it's cause there's literally nothing else to eat or it's something someone's made for us and we don't want to seem disrespectful), we don't really have cravings and if we do we can put a stopper to them, and it's not hard for us to either like or be ambivalent to hard, positive new changes (like 5:30 AM workouts).

 

But for both of us, I think this comes from a deep desire to improve our lives, and the patience to take the long way around things. My dad is probably the most patient man on Earth (world figures aside). I'm definitely less patient, but I understand that anything worth doing is worth doing forever and may take that long just to attain.

 

For me, I find I can explain my discipline through a strange sort of selfishness. "What do I want?" I ask myself, and it usually comes back with this: health, skinny/sexiness, strength, mobility, flexibility and success. I want to earn a shit-ton of money because I want to be able to afford weekly farmer's market trips and grass-fed beef, this will involve getting my University degree and making industry connections; it also involves looking good, because unfortunately our world still judges people based on their physical appearance. A thiner, stronger, confident woman will earn more (theoretically, as I know that there are some fantastic women who totally break this mold - like my aunt, who is larger but by every means a strong and freakin' confident woman) than an out-of-shape, downtrodden, self-loathing one.

 

Plus, my dream for when I have kids is to be that sexy mom that all the other moms trash talk about because they feel they can't attain it. I want to be able to outrun my child, put 'er up and do a one-armed weighted chin up on the monkeybars or something - I want her to be able to feel that she can do that because mommy can. I want my sons (if I have any - I'm still far from having kids!) to grow up knowing how strong a woman can be, and how good it is for them to be healthy too. I'm a show-off at heart, and how am I going to achieve that state of health and success? By buckling down and doing it myself. I want it, so it's only fair that I earn it. Otherwise, it's not really "mine".

 

Anywho - on to a more concrete response. Tired + 9PM coffee = non-sensical Mouse.

 

 

TL;DR

Discipline to me is a mixture of patience, emotional self-control and self-forgiveness, and knowing your end destination.

If you know where you're going (have a dragon to slay), know that it will take a while, know that you will make mistakes, and learn to love and forgive yourself in getting there, then I think you have a good foundation to develop discipline.

It's something that must be built and will take time and itself to build - but over time it gets easier and easier. Pushing through that last set or rep, telling yourself to get out of bed, convincing yourself to lace up - over time, they get easier. Remember your goal, and treat each moment as an opportunity to succeed - or learn a new way not to succeed and get that much closer next time. 

[Loren Wade]

Amazing. So glad you're doing this. Subbing.