Recording Weights

[Grosby]

Just wondering, when you record the weights that you're lifting/pressing/whatevering to you also record the weight of the bar/machine?

For instance, today I leg-pressed with 42.5kg plates on the machine, which also has a note to say the machine weight is 75.7kg... do I record that as 42.5 or as 118.2kg?

Cheers.

[bigm141414]

Don't know about machines, but for barbells, bar weight is always included (since you know you're moving it as well)

[sylph]

For barbells, add the bar. For machines, I'd say it doesn't much matter, as long as you're using the same machine each time and writing it down the same way each workout.

If it were me, I might log it like this:

Leg Press (sled 75.7 kg)

42.5 kg x 8

42.5 kg x 8

42.5 kg x 7

Or if I didn't know the weight of the sled,

Leg Press (PWO)

42.5 kg x 8

42.5 kg x 8

42.5 kg x 7

With PWO standing for Plate Weight Only (rather than Post-WorkOut)

[Lachy]

Yeah, I don't count machine weight, but I do count bar weight. You do need to use the same machine though if you don't count it's weight (my gym has a couple of different leg press machines, for example). In the end it doesn't matter if you do/don't count the bar/machine, just be consistant in the way you record, and you'll track your progress.

[Grosby]

Cool, thanks for that. But just so you know, i'd rather feel hardcore and press 118 than 45 lol But yes,

Cheers!

[67alecto]

Yes, you include the bar or whatever the machine is you are using (standard olympic bar is 45lbs, and most machines will tell you what the bar/handles/etc are when empty).

That being said, the leg press machine is terrible and you should switch to squats

Remember, little old lady Madeleine Albright was able to leg press 400lbs.

[sylph]

Yes, you include the bar or whatever the machine is you are using (standard olympic bar is 45lbs, and most machines will tell you what the bar/handles/etc are when empty).

That being said, the leg press machine is terrible and you should switch to squats

Remember, little old lady Madeleine Albright was able to leg press 400lbs.

IMO, leg press makes a nice adjunct to squats.

[bprime]

Meh, not a fan of the leg press at all. I would recommend more squats. But to each their own.

For machines I would just use the weight added on. Anything with a barbell you should include the barbell weight.

Not trying to take away from your accomplishments, but I find it hard to believe that the sled of the machine weighs almost 175 lbs. Are you sure that wasn't the whole machine? Unless you're using some hardcore thing, those things are usually made for everyone, and I doubt everyone could start out at 175.

[Grosby]

Meh, not a fan of the leg press at all. I would recommend more squats. But to each their own.

For machines I would just use the weight added on. Anything with a barbell you should include the barbell weight.

Not trying to take away from your accomplishments, but I find it hard to believe that the sled of the machine weighs almost 175 lbs. Are you sure that wasn't the whole machine? Unless you're using some hardcore thing, those things are usually made for everyone, and I doubt everyone could start out at 175.

Possible But there's two machines at the gym, one's at the assisted weights area (the one where you push and you go up and down) and the one I use where it's on an angle and you're pushing it up. Very possible it's talking about the machine in general - although when I was starting I had no plates on it and it still felt like I was working. It's a pretty big unit. *shrugs* I'll look more into it on Friday!

[67alecto]

Possible But there's two machines at the gym, one's at the assisted weights area (the one where you push and you go up and down)

That's the Smith machine. The problem with that is two-fold. 1)For things like squats and overhead presses, the range of motion does not follow your body's natural path. You're forcing it into an awkward position. 2)Overall, it eliminates the need to use stabilizer muscles to balance the bar.

and the one I use where it's on an angle and you're pushing it up.

That's the leg press. In addition to same lack of stabilizer muscle utilization, another huge problem with this machine is the unnecessary amount of stress is places on your joints because of the unnatural positioning (partially the result of the one-size-fits-all seating). You see people locking the knees, flaring them out, or arching their back...ouch.

http://www.menshealth.com/mhlists/avoid_lifting_injuries/The_Seated_Leg_Extension.php

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2006/05/the_lamest_exercise_in_the_world.html

[ETFnerd]

That's the Smith machine. The problem with that is two-fold. 1)For things like squats and overhead presses, the range of motion does not follow your body's natural path. You're forcing it into an awkward position. 2)Overall, it eliminates the need to use stabilizer muscles to balance the bar.

That's the leg press. In addition to same lack of stabilizer muscle utilization, another huge problem with this machine is the unnecessary amount of stress is places on your joints because of the unnatural positioning (partially the result of the one-size-fits-all seating). You see people locking the knees, flaring them out, or arching their back...ouch.

http://www.menshealth.com/mhlists/avoid_lifting_injuries/The_Seated_Leg_Extension.php

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2006/05/the_lamest_exercise_in_the_world.html

Any tool can be helpful or horribly misused.

I believe that ronnie coleman wouldn't have been able to achieve all he has without leg pressing 3x as heavy as his squats. 800lb squat and deadlift vs. 2,400lb leg press.

If you have incorrect form, that's bad regardless of whether you're doing free weights or machines. I see worse form in the squat rack than on machines in general.

All tools are limited by how you use them. You give a chisel and hammer to one person and you get furniture. You give it to another and you get kindling...

[bprime]

I have to echo some of ETF's sentiments in that the argument of bad form against the leg press is a moot one because you can make the same argument for squats.

The fact of the matter is that the leg press cannot replicate a squat. While I never see myself ever touching it, barring injury, I'm sure advanced trainees have used the movement effectively as accessory or bodybuilding work.

But do stay away from the Smith machine.

[Grosby]

No no, nto a smith machine, looks like this -> http://www.magnumfitness.com/new_graphics/machines/Pro%205000%20Series/5006-lrg-526.jpg But not exactly like that.

CHeers for the advice guys

[ETFnerd]

sometimes I did shrugs, barbell rows, and calf raises on the smith machine. stabilizers suffer for sure, but sometimes that's not the most important consideration. for me sometimes weight volume was important in improving strength... and you can do much more weight volume safely with machines.

...case in point... Albert Pujols, arguably the best major league baseball hitter in history does squats... wait for it... on the smith machine... you're going to tell Albert Pujols he isn't strong or that he doesn't work out right... puleeezzz...

http://www.mlbplayerworkouts.com/albert-pujols

Alex Rodriguez does leg presses on a machine...

http://www.mlbplayerworkouts.com/alex-rodriguez

Kobe Bryant does leg extensions and calf raises...

http://www.nbaplayerworkouts.com/kobe-bryant

Payton Manning does hamstring extensions on a machine...

http://www.nflplayerworkouts.com/peyton-manning

Michael Vick does cardio, bodyweight exercises and weight training...

http://www.nflplayerworkouts.com/michael-vi

maybe none of these guys know what they are doing...

When I try to put together a workout I try to think critically and not rule out any avenue that may be of assistance in getting to my goals. For someone's specific goals, machines may not be the right tool, that's perfectly valid, but I am always suspicious of people making blanket generalizations...

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@Grosby at least in the US this is what a smith machine looks like:

and this is what a sled leg press machine looks like:

Things may be different in other parts of the world... it's big, wide and diverse out there...

[Sloth the Enduring]

Back to your original question, the important thing you're tracking is progress, the absolute weight isn't as important; I'd simply track the weight of the plates - it'll save you a little math when you're knackered. The machine weight is going up at an angle, so you're not pushing the weight straight up against gravity, so the force you're pushing isn't the full 75 kg anyway (yes, I know kg isn't a unit of force, but my point stands).

[Grosby]

@Grosby at least in the US this is what a smith machine looks like:

and this is what a sled leg press machine looks like:

Things may be different in other parts of the world... it's big, wide and diverse out there...

Same here.. the machine I linked is the Leg Press in the Assisted Weights area.. not in the free weights.

EFT I feel you're a wise, wise nerd.

[ETFnerd]

nah, i just have a point of view just like everyone else... wise is a bag of chips i don't eat any more...