Men ONLY please...

[progress126]

Damn! I missed it by one!

In regards to dressing up...I've been lucky in that I've never really had to dress up for work. I work in an ad agency so the dress code is pretty relaxed. I've been wearing shorts and t-shirts for forever it seems. But that doesn't mean I don't dress up. I've got a dressy casual party this Saturday so I think I'll be wearing some black jeans with a nice v-neck tee under a possibly grey/dark grey button up and I might go get some nicer dressy shoes. I've seen a lot of nice shoes on Pinterest and some actually pretty nice clothes and combos there as well. I've never had to wear a suit to a job. To mix it up sometimes, I've gone in wearing a full suit and tie! But that was back when I was skinny and actually fit in my suit. But I'm working on that. My wife likes it when I dress up a bit. I think all the ladies like it. Kinda like how us guys love a next door type girl who can look good in jeans and a tee but can dress it up and look smoking hot in a sundress or that little black dress that most girls have in their closet!

[Guest Snake McClain]

Speaking of which; I have something of a dilemma, that I'm sure I know how to handle, but seeing as how there's guys of all ages here, I'd like to put it to the Man-Council.

I live with my step-dad and his girlfriend (it's complicated, but they're basically my mom and dad, blood be damned) and I'm paying a decent chunk of change for rent. I make good money and could easily afford to live on my own, and I feel that it's high time I did. But I'm not sure how to bring this up with the folks. I'm thinking that the situation is extra complicated by the fact that I'm rarely home (only about 6 days a month). I've stayed with them this long, despite being financially stable for the last year and a bit, because I'm never at home. But it's getting to where I just *know* that I need my own space.

How would you recommend I approach this issue with my parents?

To tell you the truth I would say it just like you did here. "I know I make enough to be on my own and for some reason I just feel as if it's the right time to do it." Just mention that you just feel it inside of you that it's time to move on. That you want to know you can do it and blah blah. whatever the reason is tell the truth.

Snake, I see that you've already been lead to thrift shops. They're awesome places to get great deals on good clothes. Even if stuff doesn't fit exactly right, you can usually take it to a tailor and get it adjusted and still come out spending less.

I have been taking to wearing properly fitted dark jeans and cargos with white v-neck shirts all the time. I prefer a "slim straight" (can't remember the Levi's number for them) since they have the best fit for me in the calves. Straight legs or relaxed fit just look too baggy below the knee on me.

Also, make sure whatever style pants/jeans you get fit right. Drop into a squat (or sit down) and look at your ankles. If you can see one to two inches of your socks, then they are proper fitting. And if your socks are white, buy new ones and throw the old ones out. White athletic socks aren't for everyday wear. Get some in black, and get a few in solid colors when you want that little pop.

And finally, with the button up shirts, go for a fitted look. Avoid cheap Wal-mart brand stuff that has giant arm holes and is generally really baggy. A good rule of thumb is to tuck the shirt in (even if you don't normally wear it tucked in) and lift your arm all the way up. If it untucks itself, don't buy it.

I would never buy a white button up from wal mart. I like your advice on the tucked in shirt thing. and also the sock colors. interesting stuff. i wear white socks almost exclusively. perhaps its time to change that.

Snake - I'm hardly a paragon of fashion but I have learned a few things over the years. I generally buy things that I can mix and match with existing pieces of my wardrobe. As long as your choices aren't too outlandish you should be able to switch things up whenever you please and it gives you more flexibility. Beige and black pants work with almost anything. That being said, don't shy away from getting few unique things that show your personality (bow-tie mentioned above). Also, figure out what colours work for you and which don't. Do you look good in primary colours or dark? Bright or subdued tones? etc. There's nothing worse than finding something that fits your body and wallet but makes you look like the walking dead.

Church - You might be surprised at how easy it might be. Most parents I know are pretty supportive of their adult children moving out (if they can afford it), your folks might want their own space just as much as you do. Try bringing it up at a meal when you are all together and not rushed, be genuine & honest and tell them that you think it's time for you to move on to the next phase of your life. With how much you are away from the house anyway, you'll still have 2-3months or more before you can do anything anyway, so they should have lots of time to adjust to the idea.

I've definitely learned what colors work for me and what don't. And I'm pretty good at selecting stuff that fits my personality. The big issue honestly is more of style of shirt and jeans (as you all have said jeans shopping is tough). Finding the right fitting jeans is really hard. and shirts...i am just really particular about. I went to the thrift store and they had nothing there for me.

I want this as a poster in my room. also i am very happy to see page 100.

[aj_rock]

I've definitely learned what colors work for me and what don't. And I'm pretty good at selecting stuff that fits my personality. The big issue honestly is more of style of shirt and jeans (as you all have said jeans shopping is tough). Finding the right fitting jeans is really hard. and shirts...i am just really particular about. I went to the thrift store and they had nothing there for me.

Step 1: Find whatever shop is currently having a jean sale. As a guy, the particular shop it comes from REALLY doesn't matter. It's not like the brands stick their crap all over the jeans (they save it for the shirts)

Step 2: Bring a female

Step 3: ???

Step 4: Profit!

But no really, I've gotten loads of awesome jean pairs from stupid trendy clothing places when they have sales and walked away with $20 fitted jeans.

[leadchipmunk]

I would never buy a white button up from wal mart. I like your advice on the tucked in shirt thing. and also the sock colors. interesting stuff. i wear white socks almost exclusively. perhaps its time to change that.

I'm starting to avoid buying any button ups from walmart, they all seem to have overly sized arm holes, and I have a habit of tucking in most of my button ups. When they are untucked, they are wearable, but not great. They still lift too high when you raise your arms.

The big issue honestly is more of style of shirt and jeans (as you all have said jeans shopping is tough). Finding the right fitting jeans is really hard.

Do you have a Gabriel Brothers or other similar store near you? It is basically a store that buys irregular sizes, mistake clothes (usually real minor mistakes that don't affect the clothing) or overstock stuff and sells it cheap. That is where (outside of Levi's outlet stores) that I have found jeans that fit me really well. You get a lot of options in sizing and the style of jeans, and once again at a pretty good price.

[Red1263]

Throwing in my 2 Pesos.

In terms of fashion, as men, I've always felt that bold, solid colors fit us best, but if one was to wear a shirt with a design, it shouldn't be 'too much' in the sense that it seems excessive. Black socks, pressed pants, Leather belt etc etc. Also here's a Link from the AoM website about building your wardrobe, to shift it to a more 'Manly' degree http://artofmanliness.com/2010/04/16/how-to-build-a-manly-wardrobe-1/

oh and in terms of speaking to the Parents, I'd recommend the traditional sitting them down and telling them, tell them everything, your reasons why, your processes (how you plan to do it), even your fears, I think the more detailed your explanations the more they'll take you seriously and will realize that you're not doing this on a mere whim but are maturely serious about this move. Good luck.

[leadchipmunk]

In terms of fashion, as men, I've always felt that bold, solid colors fit us best, but if one was to wear a shirt with a design, it shouldn't be 'too much' in the sense that it seems excessive. Black socks, pressed pants, Leather belt etc etc. Also here's a Link from the AoM website about building your wardrobe, to shift it to a more 'Manly' degree http://artofmanliness.com/2010/04/16/how-to-build-a-manly-wardrobe-1/

Haven't seen you 'round these parts in a while. Can't believe no one's linked to AoM already. There are a few articles on fashion there that I check out every so often. Never gone wrong with following Brett and Kate's advice yet.

[Red1263]

Haven't seen you 'round these parts in a while. Can't believe no one's linked to AoM already. There are a few articles on fashion there that I check out every so often. Never gone wrong with following Brett and Kate's advice yet.

Heh heh, Usually when I'm catching up on everyone's posts, what I want to say is already there, so I'm like, "Wait, no one said this!....... Aawww..." But yes, I've always found the AoM's views on Fashion EXACTLY what I'd pick up on when I need to dress maturely. I'll try to post more often in here though, I've got this Lone Wolf/Nerd thing going on

[leadchipmunk]

Heh heh, Usually when I'm catching up on everyone's posts, what I want to say is already there, so I'm like, "Wait, no one said this!....... Aawww..." But yes, I've always found the AoM's views on Fashion EXACTLY what I'd pick up on when I need to dress maturely. I'll try to post more often in here though, I've got this Lone Wolf/Nerd thing going on

I know the feeling, I just decide to repeat people half the time. Haha

[Red1263]

I know the feeling, I just decide to repeat people half the time. Haha

ha ha ha, but I don't want to do that, if I do, I'll do it too much and then I'll forever be known as "Red Echo"

[leadchipmunk]

I'd rather call you Red Red Red _Red

[KillerGriller]

Red Rum?

[Jcannon98188]

Red Rover.

[Jcannon98188]

So now I am thinking I desperately need to go buy new clothes. I think except for a few white t-shirts and the occasional shirt, I haven't bought new clothes since my junior year of highschool. So about 3 years. Never too young to dress mature. And I have always wanted to buy nicer looking clothes.....

[Guest Snake McClain]

OKAY GUYS,.....next manly question...

This is a BIG BIG BIG one for me. Maybe the biggest.

I am currently enrolled in school for computer programming. This is my first week. And to tell you the truth I have no desire to do this. I am doing it because it a) will give me a good income when I get a job and will be a job that has benefits and insurance and retirement plans and all that crap. those two things (a and is because I have a lady in my life with a son. i want a family one day (even if they arent it) and i need to know I can provide for them. this is sort of a big deal to me because I know she needs to be sure that the man she is with can help her and not be a burden. I would NEVER let that happen. But...still. The thing is I need to do what I love. I will hate my life if I'm doing this computer thing. I will hate myself if I am in school for this (most likely). I need to do what I NEED TO DO. And I'm concerned she won't be on board. I mentioned it once before to her and she seemed super excited. Then it was put in her head by her friend that it isn't a ton of money etc. BUt it can totally be a living. and I have a plan I'd like to put into place once I was training people for a while. This is something I am incredibly serious about.

Now the issue. Should I go for my dream? OR do I go the safe route that will kill me inside but never have me concerned financially? I know I can make it work the training route. I don't want anything else. That and to be a writer but yeah that's not the issue here.

How do I tell my lady that if I'm going to do this I need her on board?

Do I continue in school with what I'm doing and hope that I can make time for personal training on the side? I have to get certified and all of that too. so that is a whole other thing. I'm really torn on this and it all feels very heavy on me right now.

[Jcannon98188]

OKAY GUYS,.....next manly question...

This is a BIG BIG BIG one for me. Maybe the biggest.

I am currently enrolled in school for computer programming. This is my first week. And to tell you the truth I have no desire to do this. I am doing it because it a) will give me a good income when I get a job and will be a job that has benefits and insurance and retirement plans and all that crap. those two things (a and is because I have a lady in my life with a son. i want a family one day (even if they arent it) and i need to know I can provide for them. this is sort of a big deal to me because I know she needs to be sure that the man she is with can help her and not be a burden. I would NEVER let that happen. But...still. The thing is I need to do what I love. I will hate my life if I'm doing this computer thing. I will hate myself if I am in school for this (most likely). I need to do what I NEED TO DO. And I'm concerned she won't be on board. I mentioned it once before to her and she seemed super excited. Then it was put in her head by her friend that it isn't a ton of money etc. BUt it can totally be a living. and I have a plan I'd like to put into place once I was training people for a while. This is something I am incredibly serious about.

Now the issue. Should I go for my dream? OR do I go the safe route that will kill me inside but never have me concerned financially? I know I can make it work the training route. I don't want anything else. That and to be a writer but yeah that's not the issue here.

How do I tell my lady that if I'm going to do this I need her on board?

Do I continue in school with what I'm doing and hope that I can make time for personal training on the side? I have to get certified and all of that too. so that is a whole other thing. I'm really torn on this and it all feels very heavy on me right now.

If you do not LOVE computer programming, you will hate it as a job. If you only mildly like doing it, you will hate it as a job. Programmers spend hours staring at code figuring out where that one parenthesis is that is missing. You can get away with general comptuer work if you don't like it, but not programming. Besides, life is too short to hate your job. My dad always says, he doesn't have a job, he has a hobby he gets paid for. That is the key to life.

[The Tin Man]

Snake, I second that life is wayy too short. Out of a 24 hour day would you be willing to spend 8 sleeping, at least 8 being miserable, another 1-2 hours on your way to being miserable or on your way from it (commute)? That leaves 6-7 hours of happy time that includes getting ready for work in the morning, working out, and preparing meals.

When you mention your dream, it's personal training? As for what to do with that I'll have to think on it some more but I needed to tell you that if you think programming isn't for you within a week of classes, it probably isn't for you.

[CyningaDena]

There is no amount of money that can make up for a job you don't love. No amount. It sounds like you already know that, so I'm just going to give you the thumbs-up to follow through with your gut on this one.

If you come to your lady friend with a dream and an honest plan to make it happen, and she doesn't support you in it, then brah, you drop that chica and shake the dust from your sandals. There is no amount of booty that can make up for a job you don't love, either. I have yet to hear of any career that is impossible to support a family on with some smart planning and a whole lot of hustle. Your family should want to support you in your goals just as much as you want to support them.

[blindasutsutsu]

I will just reiterate what everyone else has said but in my own way. Money buys things not happiness. While things can bring some joy to ones life they can not bring you true happiness. If your job is something you love and find fulfilling everyday you will be truly happy with your life which is about all anyone can ask for. If you lady friend would rather see the Benjamins than to see you truly happy, then they probably aren't right for you.

[Artinum]

OKAY GUYS,.....next manly question...

This is a BIG BIG BIG one for me. Maybe the biggest.

I am currently enrolled in school for computer programming. This is my first week. And to tell you the truth I have no desire to do this. I am doing it because it a) will give me a good income when I get a job and will be a job that has benefits and insurance and retirement plans and all that crap.

And stop there a moment. Are you actually lined up for a job after this? Or is this something you've been told to do because you'll get one easily afterwards? A basic level programmer isn't going to get a great job. You might get *a* job, but it'll be sucky. You don't have the programming experience to get a good job yet. More, if you go for interviews, you're going to have to lie your arse off when they ask questions like "why do you want this job". Because you don't, and that'll show, and you won't get the job. You'd be better off getting a position filling shelves at the supermarket - you can start right away, there are always vacancies and you'll be able to focus on real life outside of work. It'll be dull, but it's not a career. No-one expects you to care about it. But coding? You'll hate it when you should be all over it.

Live for your dream career. Sure, you might not be able to do it yet. Work towards it. Take whatever crummy jobs you need to in order to get there. You might regret it. You WILL regret it if you sell your soul to a career that you hate.

And you already know it:

The thing is I need to do what I love. I will hate my life if I'm doing this computer thing. I will hate myself if I am in school for this (most likely). I need to do what I NEED TO DO. And I'm concerned she won't be on board. I mentioned it once before to her and she seemed super excited. Then it was put in her head by her friend that it isn't a ton of money etc.

I have a maths degree and I work well with computers. I should, from that, be an accountant. I considered it. I didn't take to it. I took years to realise that I'm a writer.

But it can totally be a living. and I have a plan I'd like to put into place once I was training people for a while. This is something I am incredibly serious about.

Now the issue. Should I go for my dream? OR do I go the safe route that will kill me inside but never have me concerned financially? I know I can make it work the training route. I don't want anything else. That and to be a writer but yeah that's not the issue here.

Yes, it can be a living. It could be a good one, too, if you're committed enough. I can see you being a personal trainer for a number of clients, tailoring workouts and nutrition. Place a few ads, get a few customers and you should grow with word of mouth.

I've never heard of anyone who lived their dream and regretted it. I've heard of loads that didn't live their dream and regretted it.

How do I tell my lady that if I'm going to do this I need her on board?

Do I continue in school with what I'm doing and hope that I can make time for personal training on the side? I have to get certified and all of that too. so that is a whole other thing. I'm really torn on this and it all feels very heavy on me right now.

You definitely need her on board with it, but only you can know how to tell her. I've never been good with that part!

I think you already know what you want to do. The how is the question. And that means a frank discussion with her.

Writing? That's good too. And you can spell and use proper grammar like what I does, so you're halfway towards being a professional already.

[Guest Snake McClain]

Thank you to everyone. I think I have come to a decision. i need an income to supplement me as I chase my dreams. So with that I am going to finish school. and while in school take little steps to personal training. So that way when this is all said and done either a) I will be personally training people BEFORE i even graduate and thus starting the income in that direction or I will have my degree in computer information sciences and I can have that income to supplement me as I continue to do what I want. I realized as i was at work and such that I can slowly build to the point I will be happy and that alone will motivate me and keep me happy. I don't have to be there yet. and THAT is something she would be on board with. So then I get all the things I want. See I wouldn't be miserable per se. Just unhappy if that is ALL my life was.

Seriously you are all an amazing group of guys. I would like to throw out an idea...

We should plan a nerd fitness men's only camping trip. We all find a central locale and go. if possible.

[azsf]

hey snake, does your school have a gym? if they do, go down and talk to the people there about part time work. working the floor and helping people out with machines/exercises is the best way to start building towards a career in fitness. i work at a gym, at a university, and i've seen a lot of people come through the doors who are keen on fitness and training ask for a job and go from cleaning the treadmills to teaching some of our most popular classes.

hell, you can probably do this at any local gym too. find ones that offer group fitness classes so that you can eventually get experience training groups of people and go for it. as most gym work like this is part time or casual, you should be able to fit it into your study schedule easily and it will let you know if its the kind of work you want to pursue. best of luck!

[chasely]

Hi thread, this is my first post here, but I thought I'd dish out my advice.

My background: Perpetual academic with a brief stint in the "real world", starting my PhD in engineering in a week or so.

School related questions:

1. You said this was your first week. Is this the first week of the new year for you, or are you a "freshman" in your program?

This matters because the introductory coursework for any degree is generally background material that is used as a foundation to do the more interesting things that come along in years 3 and 4. Other people on the thread may know the question to this university, I don't.

2. Where are you going to school?

Is this an Associates, Bachelors, or higher-level degree? Is the school considered "good"? Do you want to remain in your current location after graduation?

The answers to the first two questions will have an effect on the type of company and pay that you start out with. If you want to move right after you graduate the first two questions will matter a lot more.

3. How are you funding your degree?

This is a really important thing you didn't mention. If you're funded, then the considerations are a lot easier to make than if you're paying $8k/semester for tuition/books.

4. Is school hard or easy for you?

Some people don't have a hard time with school, doing assignments and the like, and getting good grades. Others have to put in countless hours to get the same grades (grades are far from everything, but they are a measuring stick for understanding/progress). If you have an easy time with school then it would be a lot easier to get a certification while still going to school.

To your other points. I will buck the trend and say that you don't have to do something that you love as a career. BUT, you do need to do something that satisfies your needs (money, personal fulfilment, etc.) and that you don't dread going to every day.

I would agree with azsf and suggests going to your school's gym and seeing if there are any trainer training programs, part time work you can get into. The exercise science people (if your school has them) may get first pick, but it's worth a shot.

[Jcannon98188]

Yes to the camping trip btw!

[Church]

Yes to the camping trip btw!

I would also totally be down for a camping trip with a bunch of strangers I vaguely know. Sadly I have a sneaky feeling that I won't be able to attend of course I won't know for sure until details are worked out...

[leadchipmunk]

Yes to the camping trip btw!

↓ I'm with Scruffy, the janitor ↓

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggRLVdOoNGI