What is Nerd Fitness?

[ETFnerd]

Recently there has been a sharp division between folks who believe in paleo views and those who hold more conventional views about diet and health. At times it has become heated and sometimes disagreements boil over, but at the end of the day I think that most here accept that different people believe different things. We can agree to disagree.

Something happened today that made me start thinking about what NF is. I was in a discussion with a member who eats paleo who was concerned about his medical test results. Because I had negative test results in the past that I was able to resolve, I thought I had something to contribute, and I shared my thoughts about how he might go about changing things to change these results.

During that discussion, some members pointed out to me that because the thread was posted in a paleo part of the forum, only paleo solutions to his question should be posted or discussed. In effect, this froze out all discussion of any possible suggestion that may be beneficial to that person based on whether that solution was consistent with paleo ideas or not.

Now I thought that this forum was about an open exchange of ideas.

What if I started a thread called: "Why Bacon Will Kill You" in the non-Paleo section of the Forum and said that none of the Paleo folks could come in and present their views on the topic. Would the discussion be balanced? Would it even be a discussion or rather a one-sided bash-fest?

It is clear that both sides are irritated by discussion of health topics from a perspective that each believes to be clearly wrong, but to me that has never been a sufficient reason to suppress that discussion. A good reason may be inappropriate behavior, speech, etc, but I think today's episode is more along the lines of intolerance of any idea that diverges from one's own.

Is this what NF has become? Is this what we want this community and discussions herein to be?

[Book]

Disclaimer: I am not paleo, and not sure I believe in paleo.

However, I do think you're overreacting a bit here. You were given a polite suggestion that giving that type of advice might not be wise. I think philociraptor's comment makes a good point. The person posted within the paleo forum, so one would assume that they are looking for the answer a paleo expert would give. If they wanted a more general answer, they could have posted to a more general forum. In fact, you could end up confusing the issue because the person could be assuming that you *are* giving paleo advice, which you are not.

[MMyers]

If you don't like Paleo dude, that's fine.

I don't get why Paleo is so offensive all of a sudden though. After an 8 page thread, nobody is gonna change any minds. And besides, this can only lead to a bad place.

[NotBadForAHuman]

I have to agree with Book, ETF, and I'm sorry if you felt like your opinion wasn't welcome there. For what it's worth, I have been managing online communities for going on two decades, including several forums with traffic that's orders of magnitude above NF, so I can speak impartially from an admin's perspective: when you set up a forum structure, it's to guide the conversation within those sections and help direct the topics, and general netiquette dictates that the forum users try to stay within the boundaries that have been established by the topics, to help keep the signal to noise ratio down.

I'm not sure this makes sense, but in this situation it would be like a breastfeeding mother posting a question in a breastfeeding forum about her baby's acid reflux and being given advice to switch to soy formula. They're completely different diets (and sometimes philosophies).

I didn't read that whole thread so I don't know how badly it derailed, but I did see the suggestion that advice be kept within the boundaries of a paleo diet and didn't find it unreasonable, either.

[oystergirl]

I've been every where when it comes to health and fitness for about 16 years due to health issues and I even blogged a Moderate Life for a few years because I have sat squarely in quite a few "dogma" camps in a hopeful effort to find healing. What I have found is that as people in general have gone away from identifying themselves with religion and culture, they have started to identify themselves and their beliefs with food dogma and lifestyle beliefs. This intrinsically ties their food choices to their self worth and it can be difficult to have a balanced discussion of all possible views without feelings getting hurt. I won't lie, I find myself doing this some of the time and tell myself to snap out of it...it's only fuel, it isn't a diety!

That said, this place is really one of the most balanced on the web related to open discussion. In certain other food based forums you cant even raise a question about "maybe we should be doing this" without being run out of town. I know some folks have very strong opinions here based on their life experience, research, education etc. and while we all want to believe we are open to new ideas or information I think somewhere deep inside we all know we are not going to change anyone's minds and few are going to change ours without our permission.

To be fair, I love ya nerd boy and I think you have a lot to offer, but you have posted threads that are inflammatory to some folks, like red meat will kill you...ok, its not bacon...

I think folks should be kind and I hope at the end of the day, even if I do get into the heat of discussions sometimes, I haven't hurt anyone's feelings because frankly, we are all here to make our lives better and support each other. I have gained tremendously since starting to hang out here and I hope you have too.

[bigm141414]

Just read the thread and here are my 2 cents:

Even if it is posted in a paleo thread what advice was offered was not out of bounds. ETf advised to reduce bird fat and try and see if that helps, not the reduction of all fat.

Also, note that he did not advise that the person should switch from eating a paleo style did (he did not say eat more grains, etc) but was just saying to moderate a certain type of paleo food. This would be like going into the veggie forum and answering someone who said their skin turned orange and I advised them to tone down the carrot ingestion. I did not say eat meat, just that certain aspects of your diet should be moderated.

Lastly, paleo is not a one size fits all solution. It has great benefits for a lot of people, but the human body is a complex system and there are people who react differently to different things.

We need to be respectful of other peoples ideas and take them with consideration as being helpful and not being condescending.

/2cents

Edit: Also note the OP of said thread was not offended and seemed to take the advice as something to think about.

[chairohkey]

I've got ETF's back too. Nothing he suggested was out of bounds. The Paleo or Die crowd needs to tone it down a bit. They're starting to sound like a bunch of CFers.

[Loren Wade]

Just read the thread and here are my 2 cents:

Even if it is posted in a paleo thread what advice was offered was not out of bounds. ETf advised to reduce bird fat and try and see if that helps, not the reduction of all fat.

Also, note that he did not advise that the person should switch from eating a paleo style did (he did not say eat more grains, etc) but was just saying to moderate a certain type of paleo food. This would be like going into the veggie forum and answering someone who said their skin turned orange and I advised them to tone down the carrot ingestion. I did not say eat meat, just that certain aspects of your diet should be moderated.

Lastly, paleo is not a one size fits all solution. It has great benefits for a lot of people, but the human body is a complex system and there are people who react differently to different things.

We need to be respectful of other peoples ideas and take them with consideration as being helpful and not being condescending.

/2cents

I really do agree with this and I didn't mean to push ETF away at all.

At the same time though, I'm not going to go to the vegetarian forum and suggest meat as a solution to someone's health issue. It's not fair to that person.

In the end, though ETF... I love you with all of my heart.

[Morrigainz]

GROUP HUGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!

[ETFnerd]

Loren, you know i got love for you my brother...

[Rosie]

MirGSS I never say no to a group hug!

i didnt read the thread this is all about (I dont consider myself expert enough to give diet advice just yet) but it sounds as ETF was trying to give helpful advice that didnt sound out of order. Its not like he went into the Veggie forum and commented on a thread asking advice on getting more iron and said "Eat more red meat!!"

[Loren Wade]

Loren, you know i got love for you my brother...

Glad to hear it.

MirGSS I never say no to a group hug!

i didnt read the thread this is all about (I dont consider myself expert enough to give diet advice just yet) but it sounds as ETF was trying to give helpful advice that didnt sound out of order. Its not like he went into the Veggie forum and commented on a thread asking advice on getting more iron and said "Eat more red meat!!"

Correct, and agreed.

EDIT:

I love that we need very little mod intervention here. Haha.

[Book]

This would be like going into the veggie forum and answering someone who said their skin turned orange and I advised them to tone down the carrot ingestion.

I'm afraid that I do not agree with this analogy. Reducing carrot consumption because of orange skin is consistent with vegetarian principles, whereas decreasing fat intake from chicken skin in order to decrease LDL levels is not consistent with paleo principles as I understand them. The vegetarian and breastfeeding examples are much better. So the question is, do you think it is appropriate in those situations? Perhaps it is, perhaps not.

And can we please stop exaggerating? Loren's comment in the thread was far from "Paleo or die". His comment was about the appropriateness in that thread.

[chairohkey]

And can we please stop exaggerating? Loren's comment in the thread was far from "Paleo or die". His comment was about the appropriateness in that thread.

WUT? This is the internet, the home of over exaggerations and absolutes.

[Loren Wade]

*reiterates*

WE CAN HAZ GROUP HUG!?

[Book]

True. Which is why it is filled with screaming matches.

[bigm141414]

*reiterates*

WE CAN HAZ GROUP HUG!?

[Book]

Having said all that, I do think that Loren would have been better served to simply point out that ETF's advice was not the paleo solution, and let it go at that. Starting a debate about such a minor thing is kinda stupid. Of course ETF had the best intentions.

[Loren Wade]

Having said all that, I do think that Loren would have been better served to simply point out that ETF's advice was not the paleo solution, and let it go at that. Starting a debate about such a minor thing is kinda stupid. Of course ETF had the best intentions.

I agree.

[Morrigainz]

Yes! Hug all the nerds! I love it bigm!

[Zorch]

Edit: Hugs for all.

[Loren Wade]

The debate party is over, didn't you get the memo Zorch? We're all haz hugs.

[MMyers]

HUG ME, BROTHER

[spezzy]

[Loren Wade]

LMAO!