JRPG's vs. Western RPG's

[HansBraggart]

the subject is a bipartisan phenomenon amongst gamers that i have recently taken interest in. i am most familiar with JRPGs because i grew up playing them (Dragon Warrior, Final Fantasy, Secret of Mana, Chrono Trigger, etc). sad as it may be, some of my fondest memories from my teenage years are playing these games because of the stories and characters. alas, long gone are the days when i could assign a lot of priority to the activity of spending four-plus hours just playing these games. especially, when you consider how much of this time is spent grinding.

 

i never played any of the modern Western RPGS (Fallout series, Mass Effect series, Elder Scrolls, Deus Ex, etc), but the people i know who have prefer them over JRPGs in a manner that appears to ooze with adamance.

 

what do you guys prefer - JRPGs or Western RPGs? why or why not?

[ChrisJ]

I also spent my teenage years engrossed in Final Fantasy, Chrono Trigger, Grandia, Lunar, Lufia, Dragon Warrior - you name it! But now I have to say I prefer western RPGs. Most JRPGs I have tried recently are annoying or restricting (Like in FF13, where there is no opportunities to explore and talk to people). I think it's because as I've grown up my tastes have grown up with me. I just cant get excited about a pink haired princess in bikini armor saving the world with the power of true love. I gravitate towards the more mature storylines of Fallout and Elder Scrolls, where the only consequence of detonating a nuclear bomb in a city is that I'm a little richer and the desert has a new crater. JRPGs just seem too black and white in their morality, too colorful in th eir character designs, and too simple in their storylines (I'm just not shocked when a party member dies/betrays me anymore.). Anyway, my two cents on the matter.

[Benry]

They both have their strengths and weaknesses.  Neither of them are particularly good any more simply because WRPGs are either too simplistic or too detached and JRPGs are still primarily retreading the same steps Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy set up decades ago.

 

Not quite a good answer, but I tend to prefer tabletop gaming simply because of the unlimited flexibility and consequences it provides, as well as the communal aspect of playing.

[ChrisJ]

They both have their strengths and weaknesses.  Neither of them are particularly good any more simply because WRPGs are either too simplistic or too detached and JRPGs are still primarily retreading the same steps Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy set up decades ago.

 

Not quite a good answer, but I tend to prefer tabletop gaming simply because of the unlimited flexibility and consequences it provides, as well as the communal aspect of playing.

Yeah, this is closer to where I am. While I have been known to waste hours putting baskets on the shopkeepers head in Skyrim I would rather play Arkham Horror or Risk Legacy with a group of friends. And since I don't have the hundreds of hours free to immerse myself in most rpgs, I've gravitated more towards games I can finish in a rental period (Uncharted, Dishonored, the recent Tomb Raider).

[Acryllica]

Grew up on NES and SNES jrpgs... but I am definitely a Skyrim fangirl too. Assasin's Creed is a blast (as long as I don't miss the #$&%%* jump!!).

 

I found Chrono Trigger in the Android store. I'm doomed. There's also several FF games.

 

I agree, there's a lot more moral ambiguity in wrpgs than jrpgs. I like to play sneaky stealy stabby rogues, and I get to misbehave with them much more in wrpgs. I love NWN for that. and I always end up hated and evil in Fable somehow... hmmm..  I think I've played out all i can on Skyrim, waiting for Elder Scrolls Online to come out.

[Duck Dropping]

I tend to prefer JRPGs because of the element of cinematic value built into the games.  More often than not in WRPGs you play a character created by yourself, and the cinematic quality seems to be purposefully vague to adhere to that.  For example (before I start, let me say that I love the Elder Scrolls games) in Skyrim, the opening scene the people refer to you as "Adventurer" or some sort of vague class term.  Once you create your race and avatar, they refer to you as the race through a generic phrase that applies to any of your race, no matter what the avatar looks like.  While I do enjoy being able to create ridiculously awesome looking characters, I never seem truly connected to the world.

 

In JRPGs, on the other hand, you usually play a predetermined character who is deeply embedded into the storyline.  I still remember my first playthrough of FF7 like it was yesterday, watching Cloud interact and have a specific personality and say with the other characters.  Because it was in the writers hands to create a capturing character, and not having to worry about good/evil choices, they were able to streamline and really grab hold of me.  Playing Metal Gear Solid 4 with my friend, I played while he watched, it struck me as odd that he never wanted to play.  On the 3rd sleepless night (about 18 hours in after full time jobs) I turned to him and asked why he always turned down playing when I offered.  

"Its like I'm watching a movie and I'm getting to see the way that the player moves inside of it.  Your actions fuel the story and cut scenes."

 

For the sole fact that I can remember getting summoned by Fillet as the Brave Fencer Musashi and that I couldn't even tell you what gender I played in my first playthrough of Fallout, I would have to say that JRPGs capture my heart more so than WRPGS.

[Raikas]

I generally prefer wRPGs purely because I can't stand turn-based combat - so the few JRPGs that don't use that I'll usually enjoy, so it really is just that one issue for me.

I have fond memories of playing Dragon Warrior 1 and 3 as a kid, but at some point in the late 90s I got into the Sierra adventure/RPG hybrids and my tastes shifted. I still try to get into the other games (I started Lost Odyssey a while back) but the combat just totally turns me off. I do like story-driven games, so I'm most drawn to Bioware's games - I'll even admit to being one of the handful of people who enjoyed DA2 despite its flaws (although I do enjoy open world stuff as a time killing activity).

[CombatBoot]

I absolutely prefer western RPGs over JRPGs. Primarily because I can't stand the idiotic -personal opinion- anime style and prefer the more gritty and semi-realistic style more commonly found in western RPGs. Games like DayZ are awesome for this: you're not powerful because you can shout japanese words and can sling a sword trice the size of a skyscraper, but because you've got a gun and they don't. 

In contrary to Duck Dropping I hate to play a pre-determined character, and love the kind of freedom games like Skyrim give me to develop my own character. Feels more... personal. 

 

But hey, I also dislike most, if not all, animes (despite having watched lots of them), so maybe it's just that I'm weird.

[Acryllica]

 in the lates 90s I got into the Sierra adventure/RPG hybrids and my tastes shifted. 

 

GOOD GOD I miss Sierrra!!!!!! I have all the Space Quest games and all the Kings Quest games on my PC when they were re-released for XP (I believe) but I have a hard time finding games that work like that, and have a balance of challenge, humor, and adventure. I spent so much time playing KQ6, it came with our first home PC back in the day. It ran Tabworks.... *sigh* memories... On that note, MIST! That was a hell of a good puzzle!

 

And how about LucasArts? I loved Maniac Mansion on NES, just loved it, as a little kid. And Day of the Tentacle on PC!

[Gainsdalf the Whey]

I generally prefer wRPGs purely because I can't stand turn-based combat - so the few JRPGs that don't use that I'll usually enjoy, so it really is just that one issue for me.

I have fond memories of playing Dragon Warrior 1 and 3 as a kid, but at some point in the lates 90s I got into the Sierra adventure/RPG hybrids and my tastes shifted. I still try to get into the other games (I started Lost Odyssey a while back) but the combat just totally turns me off. I do like story-driven games, so I'm most drawn to Bioware's games - I'll even admit to being one of the handful of people who enjoyed DA2 despite its flaws (although I do enjoy open world stuff as a time killing activity).

 

I'm the exact opposite on the turn based, I miss it so much. I personally prefer JRPGs because I really get immersed in the storylines. I get connected to the characters and want to see what is going to happen, like I'm watching a movie. WRPGs lose a lot of this because there is only so much youc an do with the whole creating a character and having their decisions affect the story.  The more the player's actions affect the story, the more outcomes there needs to be, and typically the more watered down each needs to become. I don't get immersed.

 

I want someone to tell me an awesome story and to lead my charcter through the world looking for the next chapter, not tell it my self.  This is why FF7 and FFT are still my favorite games ever. They did exactly this, while all the extra stuff was fighting optional bosses like the Weapons, or finding extra story background like the entire optional Vincent chain of events, or other mini side stories like the optional Yuffie side story. Gmaes have become so much of showing off the crazy graphics and CGI that story isn't as important anymore, just like many movies.

[stevembk]

I enjoy turn based JRPGs over action WRPGs. The JRPGs are more story driven where the others that Ive played (Fallout3, Oblivion, Dragon's Dogma) are more sandbox and more about exploring. Both are good, but i prefer the more fantastic works from Square/Enix and Nippon Ichi.

[WizardTrip]

Definitely will take JRPGS over western any day.

 

Like many have said, I feel they tell a better story with characters that have emotions and their story lines so intertwined, you can really get into them. I'm not a reader, so growing up, these were my "books". Playing through the Final Fantasies since the first on the NES, on to the Phantasy Star series, Lunar series, Vay, Lufia, Secret of Mana (we'll forget Secret of Evermore....a western RPG in the style of a JRPG?!?!), Chrono Trigger, etc.

 

I will admit, I have a stronger attachment to the 16 bit and before JRPG's, but the 32 bit generation did bring us some great ones. FF7-9, FFT, Wild Arms series, Suikoden series, and several others I know I'm forgetting. I will admit, since these, some JRPG series have been suffering. I'm not sure if they're are trying too do to much, but something is just missing.

 

A few very memorable highlights:

 

FF6 - The constant emotional roller coaster that was Terra's storyline. Also, Shadow's theme song always gave me chills.

FF7 - Ummm...Aeris?!? 'nuff said

Chrono Trigger - Frog's whole storyline always gets me

Lunar - When you found out Nall was a dragon

Vay - When Pottle died

 

I've just never had the same emotional connection to characters in western RPG's.

 

 

[notanartmajor]

I enjoy both pretty equally, though recently I've been playing more WRPGs and feeling a hankering for some FF-style gaming. For JRPGs I enjoy the storytelling and the (generally) interesting mechanics of combat, whereas I feel like WRPGs usually give me more freedom to actually play a role and make my own adventure.

[level250geek]

I prefer strong game play to strong story when it comes to games, so I tend to prefer WRPGS. With JRPGS, I feel like I'm reading a book. The story is planned out from beginning to end and I have little chance to influence it. With WRPGS, that's still the case for the most part, but you have more opportunity to have greater control over your characters' personality and their exact narrative; you main play the same main quest regardless of the type of character you create, but all the different side quests, factions that you ally or compete with, and down to the skills and gear you specialize in all make up your character's story. 

 

By contrast, I don't feel that way with JRPGS. I feel like I'm just along for the ride.

[Zorch]

My preference lies with some of the older western RPG's (Think Baldur's Gate/BG2 etc.).  Most more recent western RPG's fall short - though the Witcher games and perhaps Mass Effect are notable exceptions.  Key elements that make me like a game:

 

• Detailed Plot
• Detailed Character development/interesting character interactions
• Actions that have CONSEQUENCES on your character, and the world at large

Most of the more recent FPS-in-a-RPG western RPG's(See: Skyrim) fail in one or more of these categories, however.

[FalseAesop]

I prefer Western RPGs. Fallout, Mass Effect, Skyrim and such. They give you a world and circumstances, and only the vaguest outline of who you are. The character you make and the story yu participate in are yours. You play the game how you want to.

No the story is not as tight as JRPGs, because other than a few fixed points on the journey, the path you take is entirely up to you. The kind of character you are is entirely up to you. The relationships and alliances you forge are up to you.

I don't see people talking about "My (insert spikey haired protagonist here)" the same way they talked about "My Shepard" in Mass Effect.

I just feel that in a JRPG you are told a story. Many of them are good stories, but you are very much told the story. Doesn't mean they can't be great fun or hella entertaining. Western RPGs feel to me more like forging a story. I know the main points are still predetermined (end of ME3 for example), but for my money, I feel more invested in Western RPGs. I connect to them on a deeper level.

[Gainsdalf the Whey]

Yeah, ME is good, I like that one. Others, like Skyrim, are too sandboxy and barely anyone responds to who you are and the storyline isn't very deep or intriguing. When that happens, I can't get into it. I need to be told a story and see character development, character personality. ME succeeds for me because even though you do see Shepard develop as a character, you have all those part members and their stories.

[Duck Dropping]

No the story is not as tight as JRPGs, because other than a few fixed points on the journey, the path you take is entirely up to you. The kind of character you are is entirely up to you. The relationships and alliances you forge are up to you.

 

I don't see people talking about "My (insert spikey haired protagonist here)" the same way they talked about "My Shepard" in Mass Effect.

 

I understand this mentality in WRPG's and completely agree in a story aspect that this is true.  Sure, if you choose to go Evil in Fallout it will be a completely different story than if you go Good and the character is uniquely shaped as you go.  

 

However, I would have to say that JRPG's have definitely taken on the same uniqueness in gameplay, allowing any "Spiky haired protagonist" (Laughed heartily at that because Japanese people really do need to explore different hairstyles in their protagonists) to be uniquely different in combat capabilities; whether stats, abilities, or even special powers I think they have definitely embraced this.  

 

Whenever I discuss a game with my friends I never find that we play the same style and really love hearing how character choices affect both the embedded narrative and written narrative intended for the game.  So while we may flip out over crazy awesome plot twists in the new Persona, I don't feel like I'm playing the same game as the person playing alongside me.

 

Also, there are a lot of great JRPG's that really do allow for different alliances and outcomes depending on player choices, especially choices defined by choice of side quests.  Sure, we can't just say screw it and run off to a random arena for the next 30 days leveling up, but at the same time its great to see repercussions when players ignore quests and make a lord stand at the foot of a keep for nearly two months while you find the next word of power.

[FalseAesop]

Sure, I'll grant you that Duck. A good recent example is Fire Emblem: Awakening. A tactical squad level turn based strategy JRPG. It is all about the alliances you forge and the choices you make. Especially if you play classic instead of casual mode permadeath is on for everyone. In that game you can get married. Have babies... Have them grow up... Recruit then fight more wars... Hell even have grand babies. And with all the different pairings it really is unique to each player. I loved talking to other gamers about who lived and died in their games (for me poor Donny, Stahl, Miriel, and Virion died in battle). And who they hooked up to get the second gen characters.

I loved that game. I don't dislike JRPGs. I just tend to like WRPGs more. I think about the games on my shelf and I see more western titles.

[keliswicked]

I (being 21 years of age) grew up with Final Fantasty X. It remains my favorite game ever. I don't like high stress games where you're constantly under attack; they're just not my style.  I liked the turn based combat because it felt more like strategy to me than clicking buttons as rapidly as possible. At the same time, I never felt like the game was easy: I remember getting wiped out multiple times in boss battles that I would spend hours grinding to be able to defeat.

 

And I also agree with the above posters who feel that "story first", mainly JRPGs, is preferable.  A strong, continuous story is what keeps me playing a game far longer than a freeform world where I have to make my own story.

[BreadMage]

I have nothing truly useful to contribute to this conversation so I'll just say this...

 

THE LEGEND OF DRAGOON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JessOfAllTrades]

This thread brought up a lot of feels for me, which is why I hesitated on posting for awhile.

 

I grew up on JRPGs. My older sister jokes that I learned to speed-read watching her play FFIV. The Final Fantasy series (I to XII, Tactics, haven't played anyone beyond that) will always have a special place in my heart. The stories were engrossing, the characters still make me sad/angry/happy when I think about their stories and development. Add in Chrono Trigger, Suikoden, and other such favorites and I could go on for hours about the memories I associate so closely with these games.

 

But now? I feel I'm growing closer to Western RPGs. Not all of them, mind you - I agree with a lot of what has been said about the sandbox games. I loved Skyrim (last Elderscroll I played before that was Daggerfall because I'm old), but it was so easy to run away from the main story line. However, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, KotOR (oh Bioware) have resonated with me as an adult. Creating my main character, having the ability to play a woman after years of having to follow the story of a lead male with the majority of my games, was amazing. It's also spoiled me for other games. It's been years since I picked up a JRPG besides replays of FFIV or Star Ocean 2, so maybe I need to get on that to see where I truly stand. At the moment though, Western RPGs are more salient to me.

[WizardTrip]

I have nothing truly useful to contribute to this conversation so I'll just say this...

 

THE LEGEND OF DRAGOON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I picked this up for cheap at a Blockbuster closing back in the day, but never got around to playing it. Still have it and have heard great great things. May need to put some time into this game

[WizardTrip]

This thread brought up a lot of feels for me, which is why I hesitated on posting for awhile.

 

I grew up on JRPGs. My older sister jokes that I learned to speed-read watching her play FFIV. The Final Fantasy series (I to XII, Tactics, haven't played anyone beyond that) will always have a special place in my heart. The stories were engrossing, the characters still make me sad/angry/happy when I think about their stories and development. Add in Chrono Trigger, Suikoden, and other such favorites and I could go on for hours about the memories I associate so closely with these games.

 

Yay!! Another mention of Suikoden!! It's one of those great games I feel so many people missed out on playing.

[JessOfAllTrades]

Yay!! Another mention of Suikoden!! It's one of those great games I feel so many people missed out on playing.

 

I think 3 or 4 was the last one I played (did they have a 5th? Have they done more? I'M SO OUT OF TOUCH), but yeah - such a fun series. 2 will always be my favorite. I used to have a copy that an ex left with me, but years later he asked for it back. Such a bummer. :/