Crossfit - yay or nay?

[Huntress]

Hey Rebels

I've been thinking about where I want to train when I get my full driver's licence and can work out wherever I choose. One of the options I am considering is Crossfit, as I'm interested in Olympic-style weightlifting and the only places that teach it in my city are Crossfit gyms.

However, Crossfit has a pretty polarising reputation - for some it's a religion, for others a cult. I'd like to know the opinion of rebels, especially rebels with lifting experience. Do you crossfit? What do you think of crossfit?

What I am really interested in is Crossfit's training style and how safe/effective it is. The training I am familiar with is powerlifting style where you mostly do heavier weights for fewer reps and the focus is on how good your form is not how fast you lift the weight. And it's better to do, say, one full pull up then 20 kipping ones like they do in crossfit. I'm a little freaked out by the idea of doing power snatches or deadlifts for time, especially with the kind of weight Crossfit seems to recommend. Is that safe? Is that even good for you? 

This is the specific crossfit gym I was looking at if anyone wants to take a look for me and tell me what they think - http://crossfit2600.com.au/category/workout-otd/ - thanks everyone! 

[Padfoot]

I'm going to weigh in as someone who has done CrossFit, but not stuck with it, and only in a single gym--so take this with that grain of salt.

 

I think it can be some really great training. You'll get endurance, you'll get lifting, you'll get body-weight stuff--and I admit, the dedicated crossfitters I knew were some of the best overall athletes I knew. Done properly, it can also cultivate a real mental toughness, and the ability to both know your real limits, and know how to push past them and expand them.

 

On the flip side, every CrossFit person I've known has struggled with injuries. There is often a heavy emphasis on pushing harder, heavier, faster at any cost, with all the downsides associated. It was not uncommon for even the dedicated, long-term members to puke during/after workouts, due to exertion, and having pushed that hard was lauded and even recorded in the gym as a mark of a "true CrossFitter." Workouts frequently left me unable to stand for 15-20 minutes after, due to exhaustion and overheating. I would say there is some truth, as well, to the 'cultish' descriptors--other gyms and athletes were frequently disparaged as just not good enough, and there was some degree of shaming of people who had left or changed workout styles.

 

In the end, I couldn't do it. I want to be fit and strong, but the extreme intensity and competitiveness simply rubbed me the wrong way. I much prefer having it be that the only person who I need to beat and satisfy is myself. I'm not much of a fan of "no pain, no gain" either. "No effort, no gain," is one thing--but if it hurts, you're doing it wrong. However, if you can keep up with the intensity, and you like that competitive edge, it can be really great for those who stick with it.

[Huntress]

Thanks for sharing your experiences, that's invaluable feedback. I'd heard rumours about what you're talking about but wondered if it was really true - and it seems that it is! That's so crazy. I cannot even imagine doing a workout like what you are talking about. And I don't see the point in doing things faster just because! Better to do it well and do it slowly.

I am 100% not up for injuring myself or puking after a workout. I work out to feel better and enjoy myself, not to damage my body or make myself sick. I am also not competitive. I train so I can be a better version of myself, not so I can be better than anyone else. 

Actually I have puked during a workout and kept going... unfortunately anaerobic training, even when I am not pushing myself all that hard, seems to trigger a nausea reaction in me which can lead to not pretty results I usually sit down for a bit and then get back up and give it another go. But I don't feel like I'm puking from exertion, more just cos my body doesn't like the sensation of HIIT. But anyway.

I think what I'm going to is be straight up and ask the gym owners what their attitude is toward form and injury and competition and puking and whatnot is. If I get the vibe that it's one of a place like what you are talking about I'll give up on my oly lifting dreams until I move to a bigger city. If they seem to have good attitudes then I'll give it a go.

[insanity]

I myself can play the counter to the above post. I didn't stick with it because of school, but I had the exact opposite experience.

 

While there was a lot of people in the "box" it wasn't perceived as a competition between everyone, if you made it one then it was on you, but if you stopped for any reason, there was no form of trying to get you to keep going, there was congratulations if you made a new PR. No one puked after a workout,  though there was plenty of laying around and rolling your legs, arms... whatever you worked that day.

 

In the end, to me, it seems to be about the gym you find. Some owners are going to be all "LOL Rhabdo" and others are going to understand if you want to stop before hurting yourself.

 

To offer another possibility though, I'm currently looking at a fight school, that offers an open gym as well. You can do whatever workout you want (Oly lifts included), and then get some other training in as well.

[Vintage]

I've been training at a crossfit gym for 2 years and working there for about 8 months. One of the biggest things I've learned is that every gym is unique, and each person approaches things differently/ We're sticklers for form and technique, smart programming, great coaches and taking care of bodies to prevent injury. No one gets praised for vomiting and there are mandatory recovery/light days, particularly for those who workout 4-5 days per week. It creates a culture where individuals feel comfortable scaling weights or movements. We have members who don't do any sort of kipping movement, for instance, and they're supported in that. That said, this varies by gym and the best way to find out is to go there, watch a class, do a class, talk with coaches and members, etc. Ask around. How proactive are coaches and members with scaling and modifying movements? Are coaches coaching or just cheerleading? 

 

A lot of us do have a tendency to push past where we should - sometimes that works out and sometimes it doesn't. But the thing is crossfit didn't make me that way. I've always been stubborn and driven to push hard, and crossfit tends to attract people like me. Fortunately I'm at a particular gym where that's well tempered by people who encourage me to look at the bigger, long term picture. 

 

For the specifics of that gym, I don't see anything particularly problematic. Their programming doesn't seem to include dedicated strength and lifting sessions within their main classes, but they offer separate olympic lifting classes. I know that there are some people who are successful at learning oly lifts on their own, but I doubt I would have been one of them and I don't think I'm alone in that.  I'd encourage you to check it out. Be observant and ask questions (I'm in charge of inquiries and prospective clients at our gym, and I LOVE when people have specific questions. When people don't ask questions or respond much I feel like I'm giving a generic sales pitch instead of being able to have a conversation about whether we're the right place for them)

[DarK_RaideR]

I've been doing CrossFit-based personal training for 2-3 months until the actual box got started, now I've been attending that one for about a month. I claim no expertise, just sharing my little experience so far.

 

First of all, make sure that wherever you go, they're official affiliates. Not because of licensing issues, but because the entry bar for coaches is pretty low (as far as I know, a few seminars should get them certified) and most gyms try to incorporate it because it's kind of a trend lately. Therefore, make sure it's a place where they take CrossFit seriously and do it as their sole/main activity, instead of another side-activity.

 

Second and related to the first, make sure the coaches are solid in both their knowledge and attitude. A very common mistake is to overlook technique in favour of pushing for more/faster training. That is a highway to a guaranteed injury.

 

Third, make sure you tell them you're interested in olympic lifting. I don't know if it's a standard practice, but in my box people get a "specialty" after a while (lifting, gymnastics, endurance etc), depending on their interests, performance and strong points, effectively giving them a few extra exercises to individually work on after each training.

 

Last, like Vintage said, don't be afraid to ask and learn. Ask away, maybe attend a trial class or even watch one as a spectator

 

Hope that helps

[TMedina]

In addition to the great advice already given - don't ever be afraid to say no and, if necessary, get up and walk out.

 

Peer pressure can be a great thing, but it can also be an insanely stupid thing, particularly if it pushes you into something you don't want to do and might end up regretting for a long time (i.e. injury).

[jdanger]

Like I'm sure others have said, the quality and experience of CF gyms varies a lot. The gym link you provided has Olympic weightlifting classes and one of their coaches looks like he has some background in non-CF weightlifting which is important. 

 

I'd recommend checking it out and attending an Olympic lifting class specifically to see what it's like. If you also want to do CF observe how they handle wods with the Olympic lifts and if they let (make) people use light weights so their form isn't terrifying or scale the movement all together these are signs you're at a better gym. If they don't listen to your concerns and make you use a weight you aren't comfortable moving or won't let you scale the movement then hit the bricks. 

[Oramac]

[DISCLAIMER] Take this post with a large grain of salt.

 

I've never personally done Crossfit, though I have spoken to quite a few people about it.  Maybe it's the area I'm in, but every single one of them was of the "sacrifice form for speed" mindset.  Or maybe I just didn't talk to the right CrossFitters.  In any case, I've not found it to be something I have any interest in for that reason. 

[Archer]

my local crossfit gyms are $140/mo and don't even have a locker room.  The "regular" gym has showers, food, just as many squat racks, bumper weights, rope climbs, etc. for $45/mo.  So it's more about the atmosphere, the instructors trying to motivate you, the group classes, etc.  Honestly, the people at the cheaper traditional gym are overall bigger and stronger.  The trainers have college educations and years of competitive experience.  The crossfit coaches have just their Level 1 cert and not much else.  Your town may vary.

[dijos]

^that was my experience too, almost exactly. 

 

Mark rippetoe made an interesting point in an audio interview-something along the lines of you can't tell how you're progressing if you're doing different exercises every time you go- how can you tell if you're stronger or faster if you don't do the same measureable thing twice?

[Vintage]

That goes back to the "not all cf gyms are equal" issue. Some have random programming, but others definitely don't. 

 

Ours for instance runs in 6-12 week cycles that are laid out in advance, with testing weeks between cycles. We don't always do the same set of tests in each of those, but we do retest frequently. The programming and the testing workouts are selected to fit the goals for the cycle. We build week to week, have athletes reference previous sessions to choose weights or set time goals, and provide logbooks for people to record everything. Sometimes it's hard to see the patterns and progressions in the metcons (strength or skill segments are easier to see) until you start thinking about things like specific energy systems, recovery ability, or work capacity. CF gyms that are good at what they do can give members the feeling of variety and keep things interesting but also create measurable results over the long-term. 

 

But smart programming takes knowledge, planning, and a good amount of effort, so you definitely won't find it everywhere. 

 

When you're looking at a gym, there are a couple of things to check for: are there members who have been there for years? Talk to them and find out if they're still seeing progress. Do any of the coaches participate in classes and train with the same programming? Do they include dedicated lifting sessions and skill work in classes or is it nonstop metcons? 

[TheFourth]

Never done any crossfit, this is a complete outsiders perspective.
If this is what passes for crossfit, I think I'd prefer to stay the hell away.
http://broscience.co/horrible-deadlifts-crossfit-games/

[Gainsdalf the Whey]

You referenced a site called broscience... And comparing crossfit workouts to what the highest level atheletes do doesn't work either.

 

Crossfit is expensive because you're basically paying to be part of a group that is being coached every time you work out. It's like splitting the cost of a personal trainer 12 times a month (assuming you go 3 times per week) 12 ways (assuming 12 class size, which is the biggest I've taken part in).

 

That said, crossfits vary. There are some who program like idiots (will remain nameless), and some who are very good and really have the background and understanding to do it properly. There are some coaches who will let you get away with shit form, and others who will make you scale and make sure they coach you to hit reps with good form. You have to feel them out, which is very hard for beginners. We have a lot of crossfitters here, as well as quite a few coaches (nightlight for one) and ex-coaches (spezzy for one).

 

I personally don't typically crossfit, but that's only due to the price and the time available in my life. If I was a single man with money to spend, I'd definitely be part of it. Currently, I powerlift on my own in my garage, but when I travel, much of the time I go to crossfit gyms as a walk in. This started because I've been lucky enough to have friends where I'm going that are either crossfit coaches or crossfit box owners that let me come in and do whatever I want, whether it be participate in the wod, train strength on the side, or both. I just drop a few bucks in the donations jar.

 

As for how safe CrossFit is, that all depends on you. Deadlifts for time are silly with anything marginally approaching a weight you would use as a working weight. I DL in the upper 500s and would not even considers DLs for time with anything above 365. The key is knowing your abilities and your body and scaluing the weights to what works for you. Too many people don't, and that's how injuries happen. If you're smart and don't let the programming dictate your weights if you're not comofrtable with them, then it can be a great experience.

 

edit:

 

First of all, make sure that wherever you go, they're official affiliates. Not because of licensing issues, but because the entry bar for coaches is pretty low (as far as I know, a few seminars should get them certified) and most gyms try to incorporate it because it's kind of a trend lately. Therefore, make sure it's a place where they take CrossFit seriously and do it as their sole/main activity, instead of another side-activity.

 

Now that I've read the thread, this is one thing I do disagree with. The crossfits with some of the most responsible programming and most responsible coaching as far as form has been sid ebusniesses with classes only after work hours. For one example, at one box I visit, one of the co-owners does almost all the programming and has a doctorate in one of the medical sciences (he's an MD or a PT, I forget). He has an awesome knowledgebase of how the body works and recovers due to this and is very good at the programming and coaching form because of it. I imagine he'd never be able to have the CrossfFit business as his sole source of income because he's got to pay the bills and loans on that degree.

[Machete]

I'm CF Level 1, and it was a surprisingly easy and simple process. In my mind it gives you just enough knowledge to do it by yourself. The designation doesn't mean much, just that you are actually familiar with what CF is. What you're mostly paying for at a so-called box is the community, rather than the fitness (which really you can work on by yourself). Personally see if you like it. Then decide.

[Kevin Mack]

I was CF lvl 1 back before they changed the requirements (didn't need the cert anymore so let it lapse). Performance-wise the biggest drawback is lack of programming (usually, the form thing can be big too). But the main reason I don't do it is because a lot of the people who do it don't have any interests outside of it. From a fitness standpoint, it's good for people who haven't defined their goals yet, but once you've decided what you want, you should program around that. If you operate in a dynamic and dangerous environment where you will never know what to expect from day to day then crossfit might help you prepare.

[ashtennisguru]

This should tell you all you need to know

 

(WARNING - some "fruity" language/content)

[UncommonSense]

I'm not sure why there's arbitrary hate assigned to Crossfit. It has the same injury curve as nearly any other sport, including just plain running.

I tried three different boxes before finding the one I stuck with. We have awesome coaches who care and won't let you sacrifice form just to get more weight or more reps. It's absolutely measurable since everything is metric based.

For someone like me who never knew how to lift and didn't like going to the gym with meatheads. Finding CF and a great, supportive, competitive community has made all the difference.

Maybe there are bigger people at a regular gym. Maybe they put up more weight. How's their form? Are they actually strong or just big?

People can't shut up about Crossfit because, for some of us, it changed our lives for the better and THAT'S what matters.

[Gainsdalf the Whey]

I'm not sure why there's arbitrary hate assigned to Crossfit. It has the same injury curve as nearly any other sport, including just plain running.

 

There are some really suspect practices, and not very much accountability. I met I uy who runs a box out of his garage and was telling me how irresponsible they arew with letting people be affiliates. All you have to do is have a lvl 1 coach (pretty easy to get), and pay the yearly fee. They don't teach the proper programming techniques and most newcomers don't know how to spot shoddy programming or high injury risk form/coaching. I think it's justified on the overall level, but individual boxes can really prove themselves out. A quality box with good programming and coaching is great.

 

People can't shut up about Crossfit because it's not just a gym, it's a community. If you're willing to shell out a few hundred bucks a month and go to classes 2-5 times a week, it's going to justifiably be a big part of your life. People shouldn't give you shit about it, especially if all of a sudden you're more fit and healthy than them, or on the path to get there. If they're your friends, the should respect and support your hobby.

[Endor]

Crossfit vs Powerlifting is a bit like Microsoft vs Apple, there are always evangelists for/against.

 

It's critical that you select a box that will train you in correct form and respect your needs for scaling. At my box I've had coaches advise me to take some weight off the bar for certain movements that I don't yet perform with really good form. However it's not all on them, you need to take responsibility for your own body and have the courage to speak up when you don't feel something is right for you. If anyone ever gives you shit for scaling a WOD or swapping out one movement for a different one then you're in the wrong box. 

 

I made all the classic mistakes when I started out at Crossfit classes. These are some pointers if you do decide to try it: http://www.theboxmag.com/crossfit-workouts/the-7-biggest-crossfit-mistakes-and-how-to-fix-them/

 

Within 3 months of classes I picked up 2 injuries, one of them serious enough that I have not been able to train upper body for the last 5 months. I have never had an injury doing crossfit WOD's one on one with my coach during the last 2 years.  I don't blame anyone for the injuries I got in class other than myself, these weren't coaching errors they were accidents due to pushing too hard too quickly or performing complex technical movements whilst under advanced fatigue.

 

These days I still train at the box doing PT with an awesome coach (has a medical science degree and is one of the top crossfit athletes in the country) but I don't do the classes any more.

 

If you have the self-discipline to overcome the adrenaline rush and keep calm during a class, push yourself hard but not too hard then you'll love it and I highly recommend it. If you're a particularly proud and competitive person who will not quit then it might not be the best option. The crossfit adage of "check your ego at the door" is not always easy to comply with but will pay dividends. The other soundbite to live by is "It's me versus me". Don't compare yourself to others in class, stay on your own path.

 

One thing is for sure, during the 3 months I was doing classes I had more focus and determination than ever before and the results I saw were better than ever before in a short period of time. I play competition squash and started crossfit to try to increase my fitness level. Metcon WOD's have taken me way beyond the level of endurance I thought I was capable of, that is a very good feeling and has elevated my squash game significantly.

 

P.S. Hey you're in Canberra! Go Aussie!

[Machete]

I'm not sure why there's arbitrary hate assigned to Crossfit.

 

Besides the fact that Glassman had the guts to create an operational definition for "fitness" (which I don't think anyone has done -- if you don't piss anyone off, you haven't really stood for anything) and that it's a very interactive community with an organization that is strongly involved on the Internets, it probably has something to do with attitudes like this:

 

... didn't like going to the gym with meatheads. Finding CF and a great, supportive, competitive community has made all the difference.

Maybe there are bigger people at a regular gym. Maybe they put up more weight. How's their form? Are they actually strong or just big?

 

I leave the "meathead" name-calling to Planet Fitness. The ego-measuring and comparing (e.g. who is really more "fit" / "functional") is probably a necessary evil, since nobody would buy the product if it didn't offer something special, but it probably causes some offense to others. Like with any exclusive social organization, there is always a risk of excess snobbishness.

 

But it's really hard, probably near impossible, to push your limits if you don't have the ego who wants to know your limits in the first place. People tell the story of Icarus like it's a bad thing; they talk about learning from his mistake and not venturing into the unknown. Say what you want about Icarus and how he's dead, but he at least knew his limits. He knew, if only for a few seconds, exactly how close to the sun he could venture. Yes, proper form should be emphasized, but a little form breakdown is expected when you are working near your limits. This is where your trainer is supposed to help you find your balance between technique and intensity. Back then my entire training philosophy for conditioning was "If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough." I can't leave my ego at the door; I need my ego to tell me to go harder, else I'll probably coast through my workouts.

 

"The real competitor is the one who gives all he has, all the time. The result is that he works close to his capacity at all times and in so doing, forms an attitude of giving all he has. In order to create such an attitude, the practitioner must be driven longer, harder, and faster than normally would be required." (Bruce Lee, The Tao of Jeet Kune Do)

[Rookiebeotch]

I like to go at my own pace and decide my own programming. So Crossfit is a nay for me.

But I am envious of the social aspects, specifically the competitive pressure. Honestly, this is why I started posting on NerdFitness. I want to measure up against some of the fitness heroes that inspired me to change. Sure, everyone around me IRL thinks of me as super strong and fit, but I know I'm a weakling compared to Staci, even not counting the 30lb and two testicle advantage I have over her. The numbers people like Gainsdalf and Machete put up has me going, 'what?'. Saint's 6pack is also something I measure against. I don't know if it is smart, but I know it drives me. I'll take it. I don't need crossfit, or a gym, or a subscription fee for that.