Diet Fatigue Study & Support

[Harriet]

3 hours ago, Sepherina said:

This was a lightbulb moment for me.   I have in the past struggled with this particular part of bulking precisely because of this (struggled to eat enough).  I may have to dig more into this….and mull it over.

 

Oh, interesting. I have never tried bulking, but I have no trouble whatever putting away loads of food. I have heard them mention a few tips on the podcast, though. It's kind of the opposite of cutting tips: do eat shakes and liquid food, do add some more calorie dense and hyper palatable foods, do include occasional junk food (like a few times a week, only if you're having trouble massing). 

 

And wow, that picture. He has veins everywhere. It's alarming. I worry for him. Is he going to burst? Still, impressive work even if it's not my cup of tea.

[Elastigirl]

11 hours ago, Sepherina said:

Thank you sharing all this information as well as the RP site.  I was reading some of the blog articles this morning and stumbled across this 

 

 

 

This was a lightbulb moment for me.   I have in the past struggled with this particular part of bulking precisely because of this (struggled to eat enough).  I may have to dig more into this….and mull it over.

 

 

The article I was reading.

High-Carb Massing

When I first started to up my metabolism by eating more, my instinct was to add protein. Since I was already hitting my protein goals , this was super hard. What I ended up doing was  adding in more carbs. Mostly rice.  A long time ago, I was a low carber. Since then, I've upped my carbs, but they still were the lower part of my macro balance. Rice is pretty easy for me to digest, so it's easy to add in. I've always diligently measure out one serving for  my portion at meals. It feels very luxurious to have a double helping of rice! 

[Elastigirl]

8 hours ago, Harriet said:

Oh, interesting. I have never tried bulking, but I have no trouble whatever putting away loads of food. I have heard them mention a few tips on the podcast, though. It's kind of the opposite of cutting tips: do eat shakes and liquid food, do add some more calorie dense

Have you tried counting your calories just as  you eat normally and comparing that to the number they suggested as your maintenance? Just wondering, because I have always said that I have to trouble putting away tons of food, but when I tracked consistently it really was hard to hit those numbers. 

[Jarric]

23 hours ago, Sepherina said:

This was a lightbulb moment for me.   I have in the past struggled with this particular part of bulking precisely because of this (struggled to eat enough).  I may have to dig more into this….and mull it over.

 

That's really interesting; I've not come across the idea that protein is an appetite supressant before. Generally I only worry about protein when I'm cutting - when I'm bulking and sticking to my normal protein shake routine I figure I'm going to get enough protein without trying, but it's a little harder to fit in on a calorie budget.

[Harriet]

15 hours ago, Elastigirl said:

Have you tried counting your calories just as  you eat normally and comparing that to the number they suggested as your maintenance? Just wondering, because I have always said that I have to trouble putting away tons of food, but when I tracked consistently it really was hard to hit those numbers. 

 

Sort of? I counted calories on keto and carnivore, and I was eating around 2700-2800 and maintaining a weight of about 68kg (so, basically my normal 70kg minus a bit of water and glycogen). Not sure I could maintain weight on that many calories on a normal carb diet, though, so I'll have to track at maintenance now I'm doing the balanced macros again. 

Speaking of which, I found a cool app that quizzes you on size, activity, etc, and gives a calorie estimate and recommended macros (you can ask for low, medium or high protein, and then you can ask for low, medium or high carb to fill in the rest). Calorie estimates are everywhere, but the cool thing about this is it uses AI to update your estimated maintenance (and cutting and bulking) calories based on the food and weights that you log! I decided to try the seven day free trial and I'm seriously thinking of paying for a year of the app because I love the idea of an AI diet coach that's giving me updated recommends. It started me out at 1950 cal for weight loss (it thinks my maintenance might be 2450, but we'll see if that was too generous). I asked for low protein and low carb, and it still has me at about 100 protein and 200 carbs, so twenty times more carbs than keto lol. It's good, I'm liking my new "high" carb diet at the moment. 

[Harriet]

4 hours ago, Jarric said:

 

That's really interesting; I've not come across the idea that protein is an appetite supressant before. Generally I only worry about protein when I'm cutting - when I'm bulking and sticking to my normal protein shake routine I figure I'm going to get enough protein without trying, but it's a little harder to fit in on a calorie budget.

 

Yeah there's loads of research on it. If you're curious you can look up the protein leverage hypothesis, or Ted Naiman and his interviews. In my experience, liquid protein shakes are not satiating at all, though, so I think the effect might just be for whole foods.

[Everstorm]

2 hours ago, Harriet said:

 

Yeah there's loads of research on it. If you're curious you can look up the protein leverage hypothesis, or Ted Naiman and his interviews. In my experience, liquid protein shakes are not satiating at all, though, so I think the effect might just be for whole foods.

That might be related the fact that people find the act of chewing to also be satiating (and protein solids tending to have plenty of chew).

 

Weekly diet fatigue check-in!  I took averages of my mood scores from two weeks ago (pre-diet) and compared them to last week's scores (week one of diet) so I had some hard data for objectively reporting my subjective moods lol.  Two weeks ago might not be the best baseline model, since that's the week my dad was injured, so stress naturally drove some of the scores down, but it did show me some interesting patterns.

Spoiler

1)  My moods (both high and low) were more moderate in the pre-diet week, with mostly +1/-1 scores, indicating mild feelings, but with an overall average being mildly negative.

 

2) My diet mood scores were more dramatic, with many +2/-2 scores, indicating large mood swings, but with the net result being slightly positive. 

 

Some interesting takeaways:

1)  When on a diet, I tend to relate low mood to diet depression, when I in fact normally have bouts of lows (particularly in the afternoon).

 

2)  I have to speculate if my high-sugar "diet" causes more flat affect (reduces both highs and lows), and was I using it as self-medication more than I realized?

 

3) I am surprised at how many times my only symptom of hunger/fatigue is low mood, particularly in the afternoon.

 

4) I remember the lows more clearly than the positives.  Writing it down is a more accurate assessment than my memory of the day.

Tl;dr 

I am learning interesting things about myself, mood fluctuations, and my relationship to food.  Overall, diet fatigue is well manages so far.

[Sepherina]

23 hours ago, Jarric said:

That's really interesting; I've not come across the idea that protein is an appetite supressant before. Generally I only worry about protein when I'm cutting - when I'm bulking and sticking to my normal protein shake routine I figure I'm going to get enough protein without trying, but it's a little harder to fit in on a calorie budget

I can at least in my experience attest to some of this.  How I feel throughout the day is very dependent on how I eat. A carb heavy breakfast with no protein (even if it is whole grains) will leave me feeling sluggish by mid day and usually results in what I call a crash-nap before noon. A breakfast higher in protein (same calorie amount or even less) with some carbs usually gets me through no issues but usually pushes lunch to almost 2 pm. Very very different results. 
 

 

16 hours ago, Everstorm said:

Weekly diet fatigue check-in! 

I am trying nail the food tracking on the back half of this challenge. I am not changing how I eat. It is a bit overwhelming sometimes (one more thing I am adding to my list to do) but I am using the whole “check this off your bujo” as motivation.  

[Sepherina]

16 hours ago, Everstorm said:

Tl;dr 

I am learning interesting things about myself, mood fluctuations, and my relationship to food.  Overall, diet fatigue is well manages so far.

 Awareness is always awesome. Great job!

[Harriet]

20 hours ago, Everstorm said:

That might be related the fact that people find the act of chewing to also be satiating (and protein solids tending to have plenty of chew).

 

Weekly diet fatigue check-in!  I took averages of my mood scores from two weeks ago (pre-diet) and compared them to last week's scores (week one of diet) so I had some hard data for objectively reporting my subjective moods lol.  Two weeks ago might not be the best baseline model, since that's the week my dad was injured, so stress naturally drove some of the scores down, but it did show me some interesting patterns.

  Hide contents

1)  My moods (both high and low) were more moderate in the pre-diet week, with mostly +1/-1 scores, indicating mild feelings, but with an overall average being mildly negative.

 

2) My diet mood scores were more dramatic, with many +2/-2 scores, indicating large mood swings, but with the net result being slightly positive. 

 

Some interesting takeaways:

1)  When on a diet, I tend to relate low mood to diet depression, when I in fact normally have bouts of lows (particularly in the afternoon).

 

2)  I have to speculate if my high-sugar "diet" causes more flat affect (reduces both highs and lows), and was I using it as self-medication more than I realized?

 

3) I am surprised at how many times my only symptom of hunger/fatigue is low mood, particularly in the afternoon.

 

4) I remember the lows more clearly than the positives.  Writing it down is a more accurate assessment than my memory of the day.

Tl;dr 

I am learning interesting things about myself, mood fluctuations, and my relationship to food.  Overall, diet fatigue is well manages so far.

 

Oh, those are great insights. Sugar is indeed a stress reducer. They use it as a pain-reducer on babies in hospitals for minor procedures. I wonder if some sugary fruit could help you out and still meet your requirements? Or a tablespoon of honey?

 

3 hours ago, Sepherina said:

I can at least in my experience attest to some of this.  How I feel throughout the day is very dependent on how I eat. A carb heavy breakfast with no protein (even if it is whole grains) will leave me feeling sluggish by mid day and usually results in what I call a crash-nap before noon. A breakfast higher in protein (same calorie amount or even less) with some carbs usually gets me through no issues but usually pushes lunch to almost 2 pm. Very very different results. 

 

Interesting. My current carb heavy breakfast does leave me hungrier sooner, but I find it difficult to face protein in the morning, and it doesn't digest as fast, leaving me feeling heavier for my workout. At the moment I'm eating meat for first-lunch and second-lunch, and carbs for breakfast and dinner, so I go to bed feeling sort of empty (full stomach also interrupts my sleep). It seems to be working well. This after a few years of low to very low carbs.

 

3 hours ago, Sepherina said:

I am trying nail the food tracking on the back half of this challenge. I am not changing how I eat. It is a bit overwhelming sometimes (one more thing I am adding to my list to do) but I am using the whole “check this off your bujo” as motivation.  

 

Bujo for the win!!!

[Sea-to-sky]

This entire thread makes a fascinating read.

 Good to read more about diet fatigue as its something I've fallen into before and am wary of dropping into again as what I'm currently trying (basic cal counting, -500cal per day, reduce high sugar foods, one treat a week) is working well for me. 
this week was very stressful and i had a few days where i consciously chose not to count calories and just tried to avoid comfort eating too much and continue to make healthy choices. 

the idea of taking a break is very interesting though and something i’ll definitely try if i feel i am getting frustrated with the calorie counting. Trying not to fixate on it and just eat good healthy food and tot the calories later. Occasionally backfires, but mostly works well as I've weighed most of stuff in the fridge at least once, so know what a portion looks like and can eyeball it. 
 

definitely be following this conversation though. Very useful

 

[The Most Loathed]

I'm really late to this party but I have been using RP's diet suggestions (but not their app) since July of last year and I've had a lot of success, 50 lbs of success. I'm in the literal last week(s) of my second weight loss phase, heading into maintenance. I have to say, the diet fatigue was real on this second weight loss phase. I think there were a lot of factors at play but I seemed harder than I recall from the first phase to stay on the wagon. I'm all to glad to be on the back side of it. 

 

My maintenance plan to remove diet fatigue but not gain weight is to continue eating mostly the same foods day-to-day. I found foods I like and  fit well into a diet, I'm keeping all of those. I'm allowing myself one (sometimes two) no-guardrails meal(s) per week. I'll still make an attempt to track it but it can be 2,000 calories, that's totally fine. I'm planning to bump up my daily calories by ~300 and then assess if I've found maintenance.

I'm kind of borrowing this idea from some of the professional eaters out there who are lean (Katina Eats Kilos, Beard Meats Food). They eat very light most of the time then slam down several thousand calories in one meal. I have no intention of going that far but the idea of eating a bit under maintenance 5-6 days a week and kind of "banking" calories for a day that is 1,000 calories over is an experiment I'm trying this maintenance phase. 

 

I've already had my first allowed "treat" meal and it was really nice and squashed some of the cravings and daydreaming about meals that was going on. I did see a 1.5 weight bounce but it came of 36 hours later and I'm back where I was. Planning for the allowance going forward has opened of my social calendar a lot too. 

 

Addendum:
I was reading the thread before I post and saw at least one person say they don't want to track, it's too fatiguing on its own. I hear you. Getting up the motivation to track kept me from weight loss for over a year. When people see me who haven't seen me in 6 months and ask what my secret is, this is was turns them off immediately. You can definitely try it without tracking, just know that as your psychology pushes back on you, without something objective, you will be challenged more. 

For me, tracking works and it does get easier. You learn your favorite meals and a lot of apps let you copy meals from other days. I do this constantly. I've also learned meal templates (150 g lean protein, 150 g carb, infinite veggies as a post workout meal) so it takes nothing for me to throw it together and log it whenever. But, something I didn't see in Harriet's original post (but I may have missed it) is, if the psychological burden of dieting seems like too much, for any reason, you're not ready to enter a weightloss phase and that's ok. Wait until you're ready. And, if you start weightloss and the fatigue or burden gets too high, you can go back to maintenance and just  chill out being 5 or 10 lbs lighter and do weight loss again when you're ready.  So if you can find a version of maintenance that doesn't require you to track and your comfortable with, do that then dip in and out of tracking and weightloss at will. 

[Harriet]

3 hours ago, Sea-to-sky said:

This entire thread makes a fascinating read.

 Good to read more about diet fatigue as its something I've fallen into before and am wary of dropping into again as what I'm currently trying (basic cal counting, -500cal per day, reduce high sugar foods, one treat a week) is working well for me. 
this week was very stressful and i had a few days where i consciously chose not to count calories and just tried to avoid comfort eating too much and continue to make healthy choices. 

the idea of taking a break is very interesting though and something i’ll definitely try if i feel i am getting frustrated with the calorie counting. Trying not to fixate on it and just eat good healthy food and tot the calories later. Occasionally backfires, but mostly works well as I've weighed most of stuff in the fridge at least once, so know what a portion looks like and can eyeball it. 
 

definitely be following this conversation though. Very useful

 

It's great that you have an approach that's working! Yeah they strongly recommend not doing more than 12 weeks, 16 weeks tops, for calorie restriction. But it's up to you and how you feel.

 

1 hour ago, The Most Loathed said:

I'm really late to this party but I have been using RP's diet suggestions (but not their app) since July of last year and I've had a lot of success, 50 lbs of success. I'm in the literal last week(s) of my second weight loss phase, heading into maintenance. 

 

Oh groovy, that's amazing both that you also found RP and that you lost 50lb! Very impressive.

 

1 hour ago, The Most Loathed said:

My maintenance plan to remove diet fatigue but not gain weight is to continue eating mostly the same foods day-to-day. I found foods I like and  fit well into a diet, I'm keeping all of those. I'm allowing myself one (sometimes two) no-guardrails meal(s) per week. I'll still make an attempt to track it but it can be 2,000 calories, that's totally fine. I'm planning to bump up my daily calories by ~300 and then assess if I've found maintenance.

I'm kind of borrowing this idea from some of the professional eaters out there who are lean (Katina Eats Kilos, Beard Meats Food). They eat very light most of the time then slam down several thousand calories in one meal. I have no intention of going that far but the idea of eating a bit under maintenance 5-6 days a week and kind of "banking" calories for a day that is 1,000 calories over is an experiment I'm trying this maintenance phase. 

 

I've already had my first allowed "treat" meal and it was really nice and squashed some of the cravings and daydreaming about meals that was going on. I did see a 1.5 weight bounce but it came of 36 hours later and I'm back where I was. Planning for the allowance going forward has opened of my social calendar a lot too. 

 

Sounds really sensible. If it came off 36 hours later it must have been mainly water and food weight, right?

 

1 hour ago, The Most Loathed said:

I was reading the thread before I post and saw at least one person say they don't want to track, it's too fatiguing on its own. I hear you. Getting up the motivation to track kept me from weight loss for over a year. When people see me who haven't seen me in 6 months and ask what my secret is, this is was turns them off immediately. You can definitely try it without tracking, just know that as your psychology pushes back on you, without something objective, you will be challenged more. 

 

Yeah I spent a couple of years looking for a no-calorie-counting approach (paleo, keto, carnivore, animal based) and nothing worked. I'm already at my settling weight for sensible eating. Some people can lose with portion control or healthy switches, but it looks like I have to track to lose more. 

 

1 hour ago, The Most Loathed said:

But, something I didn't see in Harriet's original post (but I may have missed it) is, if the psychological burden of dieting seems like too much, for any reason, you're not ready to enter a weightloss phase and that's ok. Wait until you're ready. And, if you start weightloss and the fatigue or burden gets too high, you can go back to maintenance and just  chill out being 5 or 10 lbs lighter and do weight loss again when you're ready.  So if you can find a version of maintenance that doesn't require you to track and your comfortable with, do that then dip in and out of tracking and weightloss at will. 

 

Absolutely, the idea of diet fatigue is meant to incorporate psychological as well as psychological changes that make further dieting much more burdensome, and RP notes aversion, anxiety or fear of tracking as a symptom of high diet fatigue. Healthy eating with very rough portion control is one of the steps in their yearlong approach to heal from really truly overdoing dieting and getting burned out.

I am feeling better about tracking right now because my current goal (lose 5kg, be a smidgen leaner) feels so much more achievable than my usual dream (lose 15kg, be absurdly thin) and the time limit of 12 weeks is really reassuring. Plus it makes it easier when you have a cute, intuitive app (not RP).

[Sea-to-sky]

7 minutes ago, Harriet said:

It's great that you have an approach that's working! Yeah they strongly recommend not doing more than 12 weeks, 16 weeks tops, for calorie restriction. But it's up to you and how you feel

If anything im actually eating more, especially at lunch. Ive just cut out a lot of the empty calorie foods i was eating. I am having little treats in the day, like a few mini amaretti, buying the nice fruit i love but usually feel is too expensive. So im intentionally having little treats, just trying to keep them either small (eg. I had a few crisps with lunch, so they where part of a meal) or nice whole food things i love, like smoked fish or blueberries. 
seems to be helping for me personally. 
 

ps. Treats is the wrong word, but my brain wont come up with an alternative. 

[Everstorm]

4 minutes ago, Harriet said:

Yeah I spent a couple of years looking for a no-calorie-counting approach (paleo, keto, carnivore, animal based) and nothing worked

Interesting.   I actually was able to lose weight without counting pretty effectively on paleo.  Probably because all my trigger foods were eliminated on that diet.  I found it hard to stick to because of social pressures, though, especially after we moved closer to my family.  "Bake yourself happy" is a real expression in my family. ?

[Harriet]

4 minutes ago, Sea-to-sky said:

If anything im actually eating more, especially at lunch. Ive just cut out a lot of the empty calorie foods i was eating. I am having little treats in the day, like a few mini amaretti, buying the nice fruit i love but usually feel is too expensive. So im intentionally having little treats, just trying to keep them either small (eg. I had a few crisps with lunch, so they where part of a meal) or nice whole food things i love, like smoked fish or blueberries. 
seems to be helping for me personally. 
 

ps. Treats is the wrong word, but my brain wont come up with an alternative. 

 

That sounds great. Nothing wrong with treats. It sounds like the increased nutrient density is increasing your satiety so you aren't really suffering from the drop in calories, in which case you may be good to go for a longer period.

 

3 minutes ago, Everstorm said:

Interesting.   I actually was able to lose weight without counting pretty effectively on paleo.  Probably because all my trigger foods were eliminated on that diet.  I found it hard to stick to because of social pressures, though, especially after we moved closer to my family.  "Bake yourself happy" is a real expression in my family. ?

 

Yeah I'm just hungry. I can and will eat 3000 calories worth of food on a mostly whole foods diet if I don't restrict amounts at all (it would probably be a lot more on a refined foods diet). Cutting food groups doesn't work for me because I will eat straight butter, or drink straight cream, or eat multiple steaks. 

[Sea-to-sky]

5 minutes ago, Harriet said:

It sounds like the increased nutrient density is increasing your satiety so you aren't really suffering from the drop in calories, in which case you may be good to go for a longer period

Ive been trying to get more protein in my diet for that reason. Not even close to the amount of protein the maths claims i should be eating. But its up from what it was so that is progress. 

[The Most Loathed]

8 minutes ago, Harriet said:

Sounds really sensible. If it came off 36 hours later it must have been mainly water and food weight, right?

Yeah. For a single meal it almost always is. 3500 calories is a pound (really roughly). I'd need to eat a ~750 calories to theoretically gain 0.25 lbs of real weight and that assumes a perfect translation of calories to weight gain. So when I had my treat meal and I was about 500 calories over my maintenance amount for the day but I gained 1.5 lbs on the scale, at least 1.25 lbs of that is ethereal and a couple days later, I was back within a couple tenths of  a pound.

 

14 minutes ago, Harriet said:

I am feeling better about tracking right now because my current goal (lose 5kg, be a smidgen leaner) feels so much more achievable than my usual dream (lose 15kg, be absurdly thin) and the time limit of 12 weeks is really reassuring. Plus it makes it easier when you have a cute, intuitive app (not RP).

I've seen them message this a few ways but I personally like the very process forward messaging more than goal forward, meaning, if you know you can live at a deficit that will lose you a half a kilo per week then make a plan to do that for 10 weeks. Then go to maintenance, then reassess and you can lose 5 kilos more if you want to or not. If you find you can't do all ten weeks, go to maintenance early until you feel ready to diet again then assess your deficit tolerance and do that. If you lose 2 kilos, go to maintenance and assess the situation and decide you like where you are, you haven't failed at losing 5 kilos, you have succeeded at losing 2 and finding the weight you want to be for now. The emphasis being, it's an ongoing cycle of assessing the situation, making a plan and doing it, then maintaining and assessing, no pass or fails, just a process.

[Harriet]

2 minutes ago, The Most Loathed said:

Yeah. For a single meal it almost always is. 3500 calories is a pound (really roughly). I'd need to eat a ~750 calories to theoretically gain 0.25 lbs of real weight and that assumes a perfect translation of calories to weight gain. So when I had my treat meal and I was about 500 calories over my maintenance amount for the day but I gained 1.5 lbs on the scale, at least 1.25 lbs of that is ethereal and a couple days later, I was back within a couple tenths of  a pound.

 

Oh yeah, plus 500 is not so much. Makes total sense. I'm doing a super fancy restaurant tomorrow--you know, one where they do like 7 courses of tiny things, but you just know it'S 25% butter by weight. I'm guessing it could be 2000 calories including 2-3 glasses of wine. If it replaces a 500 cal dinner, that's 500 over my goal or 1000 calories over maintenance. When I type it out like that I guess it's nothing to worry about--just a few days worth of delay. It's nice not being so anxious as I was in previous diets and knowing that the app will just adjust for me. 

 

2 minutes ago, The Most Loathed said:

I've seen them message this a few ways but I personally like the very process forward messaging more than goal forward, meaning, if you know you can live at a deficit that will lose you a half a kilo per week then make a plan to do that for 10 weeks. Then go to maintenance, then reassess and you can lose 5 kilos more if you want to or not. If you find you can't do all ten weeks, go to maintenance early until you feel ready to diet again then assess your deficit tolerance and do that. If you lose 2 kilos, go to maintenance and assess the situation and decide you like where you are, you haven't failed at losing 5 kilos, you have succeeded at losing 2 and finding the weight you want to be for now. The emphasis being, it's an ongoing cycle of assessing the situation, making a plan and doing it, then maintaining and assessing, no pass or fails, just a process.

 

Oh yes, process is so important. Punishment and desperation haven't been sustainable in the past, so I'm now asking what would have to change for me to become the kind of person who does one or two sensible cuts per year and stays calm and maybe even enjoys the mild challenge and focus that it creates. Same with my lifting. Instead of thinking I have to get my lifts up as soon as possible (stupid.... I have such poor recovery that I keep overdoing it and needing weeks or months off) I'm asking what it would look like if I were to just calmly pop into the gym and lift a little a few times a week for the rest of my life. And what it looks like is not really minding the numbers, but rather enjoying a moderately challenging experience and then going home.

[Everstorm]

6 minutes ago, Harriet said:

enjoying a moderately challenging experience and then going home.

I love this perspective!

[Elastigirl]

9 hours ago, Harriet said:

become the kind of person who does one or two sensible cuts per year and stays calm and maybe even enjoys the mild challenge and focus that it creates. Sa

I do find that a bit of a cut is a challenge that I enjoy. I think it is in the mindset. If I'm thinking longer term, not that I have to lose x amount before I win, I will be able to stick with it.  I'm actually looking forward a bit to the cut now ( and not just to lose weight or punish myself)

[franksmisser]

17 hours ago, Harriet said:

 

It's great that you have an approach that's working! Yeah they strongly recommend not doing more than 12 weeks, 16 weeks tops, for calorie restriction. But it's up to you and how you feel.

 

 

Oh groovy, that's amazing both that you also found RP and that you lost 50lb! Very impressive.

 

 

Sounds really sensible. If it came off 36 hours later it must have been mainly water and food weight, right?

 

 

Yeah I spent a couple of years looking for a no-calorie-counting approach (paleo, keto, carnivore, animal based) and nothing worked. I'm already at my settling weight for sensible eating. Some people can lose with portion control or healthy switches, but it looks like I have to track to lose more. 

 

 

Absolutely, the idea of diet fatigue is meant to incorporate psychological as well as psychological changes that make further dieting much more burdensome, and RP notes aversion, anxiety or fear of tracking as a symptom of high diet fatigue. Healthy eating with very rough portion control is one of the steps in their yearlong approach to heal from really truly overdoing dieting and getting burned out.

I am feeling better about tracking right now because my current goal (lose 5kg, be a smidgen leaner) feels so much more achievable than my usual dream (lose 15kg, be absurdly thin) and the time limit of 12 weeks is really reassuring. Plus it makes it easier when you have a cute, intuitive app (not RP).

I'm certainly new to the forum! But I think it is possible to track the number of calories consumed per day! It's like a smart wrist bracelet that tracks how many steps you've taken per day! Without this bracelet it's very difficult to balance your daily activity! As I noticed, 70% of the food I consume affects my weight and not just physical activity!

[Harriet]

6 hours ago, franksmisser said:

I'm certainly new to the forum! But I think it is possible to track the number of calories consumed per day!

 

 

Do you mean the calories expended? 

 

6 hours ago, franksmisser said:

It's like a smart wrist bracelet that tracks how many steps you've taken per day! Without this bracelet it's very difficult to balance your daily activity!

 

It takes a little care but it isn't very difficult; you track your food for a week or two and see if you're gaining, losing or maintaining. Boom, you now know if your calories are at a surplus, deficit or maintenance. Add or subtract 250 calories per day if you're heading int he wrong direction, then check again in a week or two. Seems much more reliable than devices that claim to calculate expenditure, which are based on averages for your weight and height, if I'm not mistaken.

[Everstorm]

Not to mention that devices track nothing if swimming, bicycling, or doing other activities that don't align with their function

[franksmisser]

6 hours ago, Everstorm said:

Not to mention that devices track nothing if swimming, bicycling, or doing other activities that don't align with their function

I agree with you, but you can roughly calculate how many calories you burn! Moreover, the Pareto law 80/20 works almost everywhere! You don’t have to be precise))) And often determine it visually or just with simple electronic scales!